Best five wins thread. Lineal / Ring Magazine heavyweight champions.

And yet Bowe still hung in there , showed a huge huge heart and an unbreakable resolve to win. He took a bashing and when he gave it back Golotla QUIT.
Without being severely weakened from taking combos by a 250lb man to the nuts , he probably would have done a lot better. And Golota in 96 was a highly skilled fighter with very quick hands.

Bowe sacrificed his prime and career for those wins and you say they don't count?

 

True, I would rate Bowe higher but the margin shouldn’t be that wide. Douglas should be raised a few spots and Bowe lowered imo. Douglas Beat prime Tyson and Bowe beat Prime Holyfield. If Bowe had two official Losses on his resume against Golota their careers would be awfully close.

 

Perhaps I should re-watch the Golota fights. I don't remember Golota quitting. I remember him going low a lot.

You made an excellent point.

 

Imo Bowe quit in the first fight. He was losing, out of shape, and didn’t like the way fight was going. In second fight the 3 punch combo to Bowe was ridiculous that Golota landed with 6 seconds left in the penultimate round. A fight Golota had in the bag if he could just stay upright in the final round. Bowe did land a big right hand in round 9 after being a zombie for about 3 rounds (should of been stopped imo) the big right hand may have made Golota go low and quit, it’s all conjecture. But Bowe himself was a filthy fighter so I didn’t have much sympathy for him. The ref should of saved Bowe from himself though in that fight his heart was too big for his own good. It ended his career and diminished his quality of life

 

I agree.

Ultimately, I see Bowe and Douglas as two of the biggest wastes of talent in heavyweight history.

Imagine if Douglas and Bowe were fully dedicated, and Tyson didn't go to prison. These 3 and Holyfield and Lewis would have created the greatest heavyweight era of all time.

 

Bowe:

1 - Holyfield
2 - Golota. It wasn't a robbery, so it does count - Bowe just outtoughed Golota. Bowe won according to rules, just like Lewis and Byrd did against Vitali while being behind on points
3 - Tubbs
4 - Hide
5 - Donald

Gonzalez, Seldon, Thomas also weren't bad wins. Bowe's resume ins't bad for a title holder but it is bad for a fighter that at his peak was one of the best heavyweights in the history of boxing

 

I have the same top 5 for Bowe with just hide and Donald reversed. But I have to say Outside of the first Holyfield fight, Bowe never proved he was one of the best heavyweights in the history of boxing. His resume is awful for an alleged all time heavyweight.
Pinklon Thomas had lost 3 of his previous 4 fights going into his bout with Bowe, he would also lose his next bout and never win a meaningful fight again. It’s a win many heavies have on their resume, sliding out the door former contender.
Gonzalez was a big stiff. Whose best pro win was a used up Alex Stewart.
Seldon was ok but coming off a loss and he didn’t fare well against the best. As he proved when Tyson fought him.
Bowe had ample opportunities to fight and Prove he was great against a lot of excellent early, and mid 90s competition but he didn’t. when he fought Golota people forget that Golota wasn’t supposed to be a tough fight. Nobody expected that Golota would end up ending Bowe’s career.
Bowe’s resume looks more like one magical night against Holyfield (viewed by many at the time as just a blown up cruiser keeping Tyson’s belts warm) and a pretty wasted career otherwise.

 

Given that Rock Newman wanted no part of Lennox Lewis, I am starting to believe they ducked a lot of fighters.

I do not think Bowe himself ducked anyone. But I think his team clearly did.

Think about how many names he did not fight. Mercer, McCall, Bruno, Ruddock, Morrison, Witherspoon, etc. Bowe would be favoured over all of them and yet fought none of them. It seems like they protected him.

 

Yep fought very few punchers, but had time for guys like Mathis jr, (where he should of been dq’d), Tillery, etc. and I just rewatched his first fight with Golota -- Bowe wanted out - he’s crying to the ref in between rounds about the low blows to the point that the ref has to say you worry about the fighting I’ll worry about the rest, and the second point deduction he clearly over plays it as it was a belt line shot. Bowe was a dirty fighter himself and didn’t like getting his own medicine. And found a way to exit.
Newman protected him. His resume is soft and he still ended up being shot before 30

 

Would you have him in top 20 greatest HWs ever? I can't see him there to be honest.

 

On resume no. Too many guys have too many more quality wins for top 20. Top 30 yes, On the strength of the Holyfield win. Now H2h because he was big and smooth he has a case for top 20 but again because his resume is so soft the more big guys that come along and look good will pass him over and he’ll slide down the list. You know he looked great, but large part of that is match making. When you fight guys that can’t punch and you got every physical advantage you tend to look good.

 

Monte Cox has Bowe in his all time top 20 HW. I respect Monte a lot and I think he is one of the best writers alive today.

Still, this thread is making me doubt Bowe as an all time top 20 guy.

 

Mike Tyson was ranked throughout all of the 1990s yet Lewis never fought him until the 2000's. He fought Holyfield in 1999. Bowe fouhg thim 3 times druing the early 90's when Holy was at his best.
Bowe slunk Ferguson into the ether is a fight that looked like legal battery. Ferguson beat Mercer , Mercer gave Lewis hell.
Lewis also never fought Holmes , Foreman , Moorer , Byrd ans Ruiz and Tyson when it mattered

 

A lot of people do. Because he has an all time win over Holyfield, a prime great. It is a great win. And he also had modern day size, which gives him an advantage over many fighters from the past. However if you look at his career on a thread like this - look at his top 5 wins compared to other heavies - it’s prob in the lower 3rd in quality. Tubbs was way past his best and nearly bested him and then Larry Donald and Herbie Hide. It’s a poor resume. Couple that with the talent of his era - he missed so many good fighters. Most great fighters, fight a majority of the best their era had to offer whether it was a good era or bad, and Bowe didn’t.

 

Riddick Bowes 5 best wins

1 Holyfield - An all time great win
2 Tubbs - Past his best, still a good win for a young Bowe
3 Donald - Good fighter. Bowe caught him on Donald’s way up
4 Golota - Hard to figure out just how to rate those wins
5 Seldon - Tyson fight aside Seldon was a decent heavyweight with a nice jab

A good case can be made to put Hide somewhere in the top 5. Golota fights could go up or down several spots depending on what you make of them. Thomas and Dokes were too faded to crack the top 5.