Prime Ali vs Floyd Patterson (1965)

Why even start a thread on this fight? IMO I think Ali was the greatest HW of all time.
Over the years, in retrospect, I've lost a bit of respect for Ali for a number of reasons, his comments about this fight being just a start.
"Come on white American"! To be fair, as Ali aged, he became a somewhat respectable Muslim but, in the 60's, he was a NOI pawn spewing vile Muslim rhetoric and the NOI used him as a 'poster child' which the young, ignorant, Ali seemed to never grasp.
Calling Frazier a gorilla the result being Joe's children were abused at school.
Despite his greatness an orchestrated 2nd career, being able to pick his time and place for opponents, not to mention his 70's version of Joe Louis' 'bums of the month club'; most of those fights: Dunn, Evangelista, Blin? How could he even consider taking a paycheck for these mismatches??
I'm being harsh, his health deteriorated, and he lit the torch at the Olympics. IMO Floyd Patterson could have lit that torch but no one would have cared would they?

 

I saw this fight live on Closed Circuit Television on Nov 22 1965, he toyed with Floyd in round 1, making noises at him. Every time he hit Patterson he made a loud sound. I really think that Ali carried Floyd to punish for calling him, Cassius Clay, which he continued to do until his death. Also after the fight, Patterson stated that he had back spasms. I think that Ali was just too swift and very accurate that night, remember he was just 23 years old. It was shown in black and white.The audience was very vocal about Ali torturing poor Floyd.

 

Ali could knock him inside of 6 but he liked Patterson and carried him late to 12th round!
Ali could end that much sooner!

 

Holmes would not do any crap against a 1966 Ali.
He fought wars against guys like spoon or Norton in his prime. Trevor Berbick was competitive against him, Ali in his prime was much more dominant and better than Larry Holmes

 

I think it goes 15. Floyd would come on in surges here and there, especially beginning in the middle rounds, and putting on a strong close in the last third of the fight. But it would be too little, too late. In this case, Ali would have to stick to outfighting to win.

 

I remember Floyd giving it his best, but he was badly outgunned against a younger and faster fighter who was supremely confident in those days.

 

I just don't think the Floyd that fought Ali that year is the same one who fought Chuvalo earlier that year. Against Chuvalo he was a brawler, and an excellent boxer. Against Ali, he was pathetic.

 

Remember that Floyd had back spasms, between rounds his corner man Al Silvani was hoisting him up, not saying that he would have won, but being a brawler against a superior sharp and fast Ali would still not guarantee a victory as his style would have played into Ali's hands. I saw it live, the crowd was very mad because Ali was toying with Patterson. I remember Robert Goulet singing the National Anthem. Harry Krause was the referee

 

I don't think Patterson would have beaten Ali without the back trouble either, but it may have been the war it was originally billed as.

 

Ffs. He said himself that the injury kicked in in the 5th round, I think it was. Did he look the least competitive competitive up until that point?

This was a mismatch, back spasms or not.

 

Can't agree. In '72 Patterson gave Ali a tough time, and that was not close to the Patterson of the 60s.

 

That was not close to Ali of the 60's. Floyd said so himself.

And, no, he didn't give him a particularly tough time in '72. Ali messed about for 4-5 rds, but when he started to go on the offensive the fight was soon over. Floyd landed some good shots, but as soon as Ali put the gas pedal down it was only going to end in one way.

But going back to the fight we're talking about, in '65, did you feel Floyd was the least bit competitive for the first 5, before he said he injured his back?

 

No, but Floyd was often a slow starter, so it is hard to tell.