Cleveland Big Cat Williams 1960 vs Carl The Truth Williams 1985.

Perhaps you missed my "of note" part? Rodney was an obscure name who beat nobody of note and lost to bums. On top of that he was already battered from years of football, BEFORE he became a boxer. The fact that you even bought him up is laughable and shows the extent of your intellectual dishonesty.

 

I agree, except I don't think Carl dominates Cleve the way he did Weaver. Williams may outjab Cleve, but he wouldn't probably be pounding at will like he did on Weaver.

 

tisk tisk LaMotta

 

Plus, since Weaver DESTROYED the Truth, think what the Big Cat would do to the Truth. Bigger and stronger than Weaver, far busier, and a much faster starter, Williams would be lucky to last a couple rounds. I think it would only last 2 tbh. This time, the Truth might never fight again.

 

Rodney Frazier wasn’t that bad though, I saw him knockout Bobby Crabtree a lot quicker than other fighters did. And of course Dave Jaco knocked out the mighty Razor Ruddock after Carl had crushed Jaco in just one round when Jaco was 12-0. Then of course Carl became the first to stop 16-1 Bert Cooper and 13-0 Jesse Ferguson. As I recall, Ferguson had just beat Buster Douglas. So it is not dishonest to claim Carl stopped good fighters on film.

It would be dishonest to claim Cleveland stopped good fighters on film however.

People remember what Weaver and Tyson did to Williams more than they remember what Williams did to Larry Holmes and Tim Witherspoon.

But they forget Tyson and Weaver have plenty of filmed knockout wins over top fighters between them.

You don’t get that with Cleveland Williams. There is no evidence that Cleveland knocking out top fighters on film. So it is a shot in the dark to enable him with such a chance like that against Cleveland Williams. You don’t get to promote Cleveland into Tyson and Weaver territory without the filmed proof.

I honestly think a 16-1 Bert Cooper beats Cleveland Williams. That Tim Witherspoon (who Carl was robbed against) would smash Williams to smithereens. But I think Cleveland keeps getting up until he is stopped.

I doubt Cleveland gets past 13-0 Jesse Ferguson if I am honest because Cleveland certainly cannot beat the Buster Douglas that Ferguson did.

You can’t say that about the knockout or stoppage victims of Cleveland. They’re not beating Carl like Carl’s victims can beat Cleveland.

Which stoppage victims of Cleveland beat Carl? I would like to see that list!

 

Edit

 

Another good one from Richard!
And I can't can't decide!!
Edit
After a slow start, with Carl doing enough to win the first 3rd, he's caught and dropped by a Haymaker by Cleveland.
He manage s to survive the round and and gets back into the fight. Mid way thru the seventh, Carl is once again dropped but this time he doesn't make it up in time.

 

Cleveland Williams by a knockout.

 

I'd take Cleve to connect at some point, and The Truth did not have great whiskers, or a big punch.

 

Weaver wasn't as fast as Williams,and his power wasn't quite up there either.

 

Carl had a great left jab, average power , and a mediocre chin,he gets ko'd here.

 

I guess Carl always got tagged at some point, yet he survived Witherspoons bombs and outboxed him. Carl had a history of being decked in fights he won. Often getting up to score knockdowns himself. I think he was plenty game. I guess I can’t rule out a hasty stoppage against Carl. I just think Cleveland got hit a lot himself and had problems with Ernie Terrells jab and Carl had a better one. Carl decked Morrison, Furguson, Cooper and had a 51% KO ratio himself. Whereas Cleveland had a history of being decked by Sly Jones, Satterfeild, Liston, Ali, MAC Foster, Al Jones and Mel Turnbow. Of the two Cleveland was knocked out 8 times to Carl’s 6 so A prime version of Carl might truthfully stop Cleveland.

 

And we would like to see the reverse list !