Change my mind about David Haye.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Dance84, Nov 19, 2020.

  1. Dance84

    Dance84 Unicorn and seastar land Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2017
    Messages:
    8,064
    Likes Received:
    5,451
    Truth is im a casual with David Haye. I've only seen some fights. On film in some fights , he looks great his power is there. Good movement great athleticism. I think if he were to compete today he can have a chance at becoming undisputed heavyweight champion he is way better in my opinion than the current generation, and i believe he would do well in many eras. Like the title says change my mind about david haye, tell some fights he looked not only lost but struggled and showed his limits.
     
  2. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2007
    Messages:
    112,736
    Likes Received:
    47,530
    Won one fight that mattered at heavy and it was a very close points decision win.
     
    Barm, michael mullen, Oddone and 5 others like this.
  3. Man_Machine

    Man_Machine Boxing Junkie Full Member

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2010
    Messages:
    8,432
    Likes Received:
    9,384
    More or less talked his way into a Klitschko bout and showed just how much better he was at talking than heavyweight boxing.
     
  4. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft He Who Saw The Deep Full Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2019
    Messages:
    27,126
    Likes Received:
    44,857
    I always thought Haye was too sloppy when he had a guy hurt. Like, Wilder level sloppy. His loss to Carl Thompson came from so called inexperience, but I tend to think prime for prime, Carl beats any Haye. If you look at what he did in the CAT fight, it's pretty clear that he figured the old man was hurt and he had nothing to worry about. He rushed in, Carl does what Carl does best, and irons him out like Miracle Matthew.

    But you can see that sloppiness and extreme aggression years later, vs Ruiz or Harrison for example. Inexperience had nothing to do with those two things. The problem Haye had there, was pacing, and he was never the best at that either.

    You have to remember just how old Carl Thompson was, and just how much mileage he had.
     
  5. zulander

    zulander Boxing Addict Full Member

    Joined:
    Mar 17, 2006
    Messages:
    5,834
    Likes Received:
    1,496
    Good, probably a very good Cruiser but i think he took the path of least resistance.
    World class power but some doubts over stamina and chin. He had fast short combos, but then needed a long reset. Got cut against Fragomeni and was looking under pressure but rallied and landed some big powers shots to get the win.

    Beat Mormeck away in a good win after getting off the canvas (always thought although he got clipped and hurt, there was a slip involved as well) and then beat Enzo to be a unified champ but if you do a little digging Enzo didn't have a loads of world class wins either. HE didn't fight USS or O'Neil Bell who were active around this time I think.

    He then talks his way up at heavy. Looks good at times in beating up a past prime Ruiz, he manages to squeak by Valuev but this was done better by an ancient Holyfield although Evander didn't get the nod.

    The win over Chisora and the fashion of it was solid enough but that was his last meaningful night in the ring. He was one of my favorite fighters in his prime at Crusiser but then he became this sales man type heavyweight and the game plan for Wlad was all wrong - as soon as he realised how fast Wlad was on his feet he spent the night in reverse or trying to fall on the floor.

    He might have chance of catching and finished AJ or someone stiff and robotic but I cant see him beating Fury - there is a sparring video of him and Wilder playing rock em sock em robots so his power gives him a chance but hes naturally smaller than the big big heavy's. Someone like Andy Ruiz - good chin and good stamina would cause him trouble. At cruiser he was a KO puncher at heavy more a Knockdown puncher. He could win a belt again but would never hold them all.

    Good fighter, world class but could possibly have been a great one.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2020
    Gatekeeper and ideafix12 like this.
  6. BitPlayerVesti

    BitPlayerVesti Boxing Drunkie Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 28, 2017
    Messages:
    8,584
    Likes Received:
    11,096
    Wlad is the only fight I've seen of him recently, from that I don't think he could beat Joshua or Fury.

    He was constantly going way off balance against Wlad when trying to get in range, and a lot of the time just looked outright sloppy. He could move his body fairly quickly, but his handspeed wasn't great.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2020
  7. Mario040481

    Mario040481 Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Mar 27, 2019
    Messages:
    366
    Likes Received:
    474
    NO. No. Outside of some sorta outta nowhere accidental one punch KO, (as it is HW boxing, that is a legit possibility) David Haye would not ever win a legitimately recognized HW title from a legitimately recognized champion in the current era, nor any other era. Haye was a skilled fighter, and I don't wish to rag him too badly, but, no. It was absolutely appropriate that for him to win his HW title it would be against the side show fighter whom he got it off of. Again. No, but on top of that the word undisputed was mentioned, and that creates no's to the infinite nth degree
     
  8. ideafix12

    ideafix12 Well-Known Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 30, 2010
    Messages:
    2,007
    Likes Received:
    861
    I think Haye has a 50 50 chance of beating Joshua .. Against Tyson Fury he would not have a chance he lose by Tko
     
    ikrasevic likes this.
  9. Jel

    Jel Obsessive list maker Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2017
    Messages:
    7,812
    Likes Received:
    13,075
    I bought into it, paid for the broadcast and then cursed Haye the whole way through for his abject performance. Hated the guy ever since. All talk.
     
  10. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Feb 15, 2006
    Messages:
    71,512
    Likes Received:
    27,069
    Haye's limitations were as profound as his brilliance, and he knew it.

    Understand this, and a lot about him becomes clearer.

    He might well have been the most formidable finisher, in either the cruiserweight or heavyweight division, but he had an Achilles heel.

    In a drawn out fight, he was very prone to running out of steam, and he built his fight strategies around this weakness.

    Put him in todays era, and he faces the same dilemmas.
     
  11. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2005
    Messages:
    58,748
    Likes Received:
    21,564
    He was useless.
    His best win at heavyweight was KO of Chisora, a glorified journeyman.
    At cruiserweight he's even more overrated.
     
  12. Toney F*** U

    Toney F*** U Boxing junkie Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2019
    Messages:
    7,188
    Likes Received:
    11,431
    I like Haye, very exciting fighter and I think he was a very good cruiser. He had his flaws, patchy resume, tended to get wild at times, also had a whatever chin and suspect stamina, I actually really wasn’t a fan at first because I thought he was just another wild slugger. The more I watched him the more I appreciated him, unified champion, underrated technician, speed, power, athletic, and always in great shape. One of those guys that’s both overrated and underrated

    I still wouldn’t pick him over any elite heavyweight in their prime
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2020
    Wizbit1013 and ideafix12 like this.
  13. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2014
    Messages:
    27,090
    Likes Received:
    36,040
    I like Haye but he has zero chance again Joshua, Fury, or Usyk.
     
    Toney F*** U likes this.
  14. Gatekeeper

    Gatekeeper Well-Known Member Full Member

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2009
    Messages:
    2,367
    Likes Received:
    2,986
    Zero chance ?? Don't talk rubbish.
     
    Wizbit1013 and George Crowcroft like this.
  15. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2014
    Messages:
    27,090
    Likes Received:
    36,040
    None whatsoever.
     
    Clinton and Toney F*** U like this.