Fighters Who Would Have Beaten A Prime Ali

Moreso Eddie Futch's gameplan.

 

Best post.

 

Eddie Futch was a master strategist, he knew that Muhammad Ali was still very rusty before the Fight Of The Century in 1971, Ali had been out of action for 43 months with only two comeback fights under his belt. In 1967, when Yank Durham was asked about a title fight between Joe Frazier and Ali, his reply was that Joe was too green for the the likes of Clay, as Yank often referred to Ali. Futch knew Ali well, he was in Charlie Powell's corner when Ali stopped him in round 3, om Jan 24 1963 in Pittsburgh.

 

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I think some would be surprised how well he would do if he hopped out of a time machine, got a good camp in, and fought today. He's fast, good reflexes, and has ungodly punch resistance.

Ernie Terrell had similar height/reach to Deontay Wilder, Bugner was 6'4" 240, human beings didn't become some different species in 1990.

So I don't think there's anyone who beats him 10 times out of 10 tries. There might be a dozen who would take some wins off him a such a series.

 

It's the rock, paper, scissors of boxing. Boxer beats slugger, slugger beats swarmer, swarmer beats boxer.

Swarmers like Frazier had to be deterred from getting inside and doing their work by hard hitters. Moving away and boxing just gives them momentum and it saps the boxer's energy. But heavy handed sluggers would swat the pressure fighter back. However, they are often crude which gives the boxer room and time to do his work; 'make 'em miss and make 'em pay,' is the mantra. But with pressure fighters, you make them miss and another punch is on its way. Boxers don't get the chance to get into their rhythm.

The best Ali beats the best Foreman who beats the best Frazier who beats the best Ali is the classic triangle. Although I'm not convinced that the best Joe always beats Ali. But that's because Ali is the exception, not the rule.

 

You two have a great debate and both of you very good points!

I just bring up some small things:

I guess there is no doubt that Ali is all in all BY FAR the leading candidate for being the GOAT in HW, followed by Louis.
The question is does this mean he was like unbeatable in his prime?

Look at Basketball: I am not a fan of this sport and dont know so much about it, but about 20 years ago a very good buddy of mine was a huge fan, and some of his pals were fans too.
They always brought the statement how untouchable Air Jordan is, that he will be untouchable for all times, etc.

Like i said i am not an Expert, but it seems LeBron has done things in the last 5 years that even ESPN people like Max Kellermann, Steven A. Smith (we know them from Boxing) etc. at least do debates about this, and some people even say LeBron has a chance to be the new GOAT, or at least around the same level as Jordan.
I can not judge that! Maybe its all hot air...? I don t know.


But fact is:
As much ESPN etc. lists Ali over and over again as the HW GOAT, and many other Boxing sides etc. do too, it doesnt change the fact not anyone in our field (Boxing) agree to that.

Examples:
Historians like Hank Kaplan and Bert Sugar saw Louis as the HW GOAT.

Now in 2020:

In the show "Max on Boxing" with Kellerman, speaking with Foreman about Wilder-Fury 2:

Kellerman: "Is Ali still the GOAT in HW Boxing?"

Foreman: "Ali is the greatest man that ever put on Boxing gloves. Louis is the GOAT."

Teddy Atlas after Ali´s death in 2016 and just currently in his podcast: "Louis is the GOAT"

Frazier on the question if Louis could beat Ali: "Are you kidding? I was able to beat him, so you can be sure Joe could it even more likely because he is better then me."



It is a never ending story and discussion.

But do all of them (Kaplan, Sugar, Foreman, Atlas, Frazier) hate Ali or why do they name Louis as the GOAT?


To me its Ali, but i dont understand how they judge it and why they come to their conclusions.

 

Wlad.

 

Ali can run, but he can't hide. That is why Joe Louis will win. Marciano may chase him out of the ring.

 

The Big Dog got him. For all you all suckers that don't know that be Lennox Lewis.

Jack Johnson as well. His hands as quick as Ali's with a real grown up pocket defense. JJ would catch Ali's jab in his glove the way Hank Aaron caught a baseball. Then bring it over in one motion..
Johnson was a cutting slashing type of puncher. Ali can't fuk with Jack either. If anyone is gonna be mindfuked it's Ali.

 

Do you think Ali's right hand lead would find a home on the Big Homie?

 

Your Goddamn right

 

He wouldn't be fit to carry the spit bucket for those guys let alone spar them. That's when men were men. They could do a full days work and still beat the tar out of him in the evening.

 

Prime Frazier obviously
Holmes
Joe Louis possibly
That's it.
Case closed.
These guys mentioning Fury just make me laugh. Who has this big clown beat? No one that's who. Easily one of the most overrated fighters on this board