George Foreman vs Cleveland Williams

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Dance84, Jan 5, 2021.



Who wins

  1. Foreman Knockout

    98.5%
  2. Foreman Decision

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  3. Williams Knockout

    1.5%
  4. Williams Decision

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  5. Draw

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Dont let Swag see the results of this post. Itll take him a week to recover from seeing that 100% of participates pick his man crush to lose by KO.
     
    choklab likes this.
  2. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    1. I am part of the 100%, I voted for Foreman by KO you moron :lol:

    2. Just because I don't share Choklab and yours' irrational and unhealthy hatred for the man, does not make him my "man crush".
     
  3. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I agree Williams put up a respectable effort against Foster in their first fight rupturing one of Foster's eardrums,
    But I think Williams put up an even better effort in their second fight despite not lasting as long
    "Nine years later, in the fall of 1969 when Williams was over the hill and trying to recapture some of his old magic, he seemed to stumble into a time warp and revisit the Liston fights against another hungry contender in former Marine, Mac Foster. In September of that year, Mac stopped Cleve in the fifth round in Fresno. In November the two men locked horns in another thriller and Foster knocked out Williams in the third at Houston.

    That third round of the return match was rated the fifth best round of the year by The Ring magazine and described as “…. a thrill-packed session which began with Williams rushing out of his corner and attacking with a crisp left hook at close range. A sharp right hand buckled Foster’s knees. It seemed as if the Big Cat had regained his old power and was showing young Foster how it ought to be done.

    “But Mac fought back with a vengeance. They slugged it out with lefts and rights, with Williams seemingly having an edge in the furious exchange. Foster shot a vicious left hook to the Big Cat’s jaw which floored him. After Cleve arose, another hook sent him back to the canvas. A few moments later, Foster landed a tremendous left hook to Williams’ jaw, then crashed a right and it was all over. Williams fell heavily to the floor.”

    Source: http://archive.boxing.media/careful_with_that_cleaver_cleve.html

    "Before the third round Williams was instructed by his corner that boxing was getting him nowhere and to use his only remaining weapon of substantial value—the left hook. At the bell he charged off his stool with a barrage of hooks and rights to the head and body and Foster was momentarily stunned—rather more than he likes to admit—by a hook that would have knocked out a lesser man."

    Source: https://vault.si.com/vault/1970/01/05/the-fighting-marine-they-named-macarthur
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2021
  4. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Big difference between assessing the mans limitations realistically and having an irrational/unhealthy hatred for the man. I would argue you have an unnatural/unhealthy obsession with him, or more likely his body since thats basically all he brought to the table at the highest level of the sport.
     
    choklab likes this.
  5. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Numerous posters have called you out on your abnormal obsession with Williams, that's rivaled only by Choklab. Only difference is, Choklab is open with his hatred.
    Wish someone told that to the highest rated heavyweight not named Liston in Machen (some might even say the highest level of the sport) who failed to beat Williams, was given a draw (arguably gifted), and subsequently attempted to kill himself and was admitted to a mental health facility because Williams had just ended his chances of a title shot (for the foreseeable future at least).

    I'm also sure all the top heavyweights Williams fought win or lose, heavily praised him on his power, and speed because they were impressed with his body.
     
  6. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    If you call this a success, then fair enough, but I wouldn't call Williams effort a success. Liston dominated him.
     
  7. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Williams won 2 or 3 rounds of the 5 rounds they had together, staggered Liston, broke his nose, and almost knocked Liston out by his own admission.
     
    William Walker likes this.
  8. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    5 rounds in 2 fights says enough. Besides, I've seen both figths and Liston wasn't close to being stopped in any of them. He might be respectful to Williams and I don't doubt that he could hit hard, but Sonny dominated him.
     
  9. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Oh so now Williams was such a hard hitter he was responsible for Machen's mental breakdown?? LOL. You might want to read the reports of the Williams-Machen fight (trust me, youll never see it), your characterizations of it are almost as comical as your characterizations of his snoozefest with Mac Foster. Some have the benefit of being able to watch it and dont have to take the word of a guy who papers his bedroom with shirtless pictures of Williams. LOL.

    Heavy emphasis on the word "LOST". When Billy Daniels and Alex Miteff are the two best wins on your resume Im not really concerned with how hard you can hit a heavy bag. Never translated into a notable win.

    Some people just get awwed by a physique and supposed power. I couldnt care less whether Shavers or Williams were these incredibly hard punchers because the wins they have to illustrate are against nobodies or retreads. They may very well have hit hard, hell, they could have hit harder than anyone who ever lived but that doesnt mean **** when your resume doesnt reflect it. You can argue until youre blue in the fact about Williams (and Im sure youd like to) but all of the huffing and puffing you do wont change the fact that in nearly 100 fights the guy could never beat a legitimate threat in the top ten. The best he could muster were uninspiring wins against fringe contenders who might have luckily found their way into the top ten, briefly, when he met them. Thats it. The facts dont lie.
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2021
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  10. Nighttrain

    Nighttrain 'BOUT IT 'BOUT IT Full Member

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    I recall there was a thread that debated Muhammad Ali‘s height for about 30 pages estimates ran 6’2 to 6’4. I think it was the Stanley Ketchel shadow footage that drove Reznick to the Darkside . I enjoyed hearing tales about b “Boston tom McMustache”, The thread about Primo Carnera versus Riddick Bowe was also a fave.
     
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  11. escudo

    escudo Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Don't think I've ever seen a poll so unanimous.
     
  12. William Walker

    William Walker Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    No, we don't.
    No historian or fan of boxing can deny that Ernie Terrell, despite being an unexciting, and even annoying fighter 2 watch, was one of the most dominant heavyweights of the 60s. And Williams knocked him out. He was one of only two men 2 floor the huge Terrell, and Terrell fought many of the best and most experienced fighters of the 60s. That cannot be denied either. Daniels and Miteff, while one-hit wonders, can hardly be compared w/ Terrell and labeled as Williams' best wins. I'm not defending Williams cuz I think he was an amazing fighter. I admit, he has a mediocre resume. But this is a point that often gets made against Cleveland unfairly.

    Is there anything about boxing that u do like?
     
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  13. Titan1

    Titan1 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Foreman by 2nd round kayo.
     
  14. sweetsci

    sweetsci Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I think the point, maybe, in naming Daniels and Miteff, is that they were the only guys rated in the top 10 at the time of their respective fights, who Williams beat. Ever.

    Terrell was unranked when Williams beat him. Terrell's April 1963 win over Williams got him into the top 10. True, this was apparently a very close fight and Terrell went on to bigger and better things.

    In 1962 when he lost to Williams, Terrell really hadn't done anything to warrant a rating yet and thus wasn't ranked. It's a nice name on Williams' record, but I don't think it really means much at that point.
     
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  15. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Exactly.
     
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