It doesn't matter what context you frame it in, Parker is still a better win to have than Ortiz because: - Parker has never been stopped. - Parker has fought better opposition. - Parker won a world title. Compared to that, what has Ortiz achieved other than being knocked out by Wilder?
He also got a robbery "win" against Radchenko, who was 7:5:0 at that time and lost in his last match against a Kazakh guy who had only one fight. Szpilka didn't only lose, he got beaten up from one corner to the other, went down several times, despite fighting as a HW in CW. This guy wouldn't even last against Jake Paul these days. Wilder's win over him means really nothing.
Parker lost to better opposition so that point is mute, got a gift decision against an old Chisora that most think Chisora won, and beat Takam ? lol. Parker is better than Ortiz because Parker beat Ruiz who went on to beat Joshua wheras Ortiz's claim to fame is stopping prime Jennings in 6 rounds but you're not reading my posts thoroughly. If you're using Parker to support Aj's resume then you have to take out Ruiz off Parkers wins because besides making Joshua himself quit, Ruiz has done nothing of note and just recently got dropped by shot to bits Arreola. Someone like Whyte for example gets the benefit of beating Parker because Parker beat Ruiz, Ruiz beat Joshua and Whyte didn't loose to Ruiz. Not Joshua because Joshua lost to Ruiz. Whyte did loose to Joshua but at that point Whytes only good win isn't Parker, he has Rivas as well because Rivas beat Bryant Jennings and it's not a dumb neverending triangle anymore. Just my opinion. I don't count Parker for Joshua's resume because Parkers claim to fame is beating Ruiz, whos claim to fame is battering Joshua, who beat Parker....
Ruiz has done nothing of note? Wow. Yet Ortiz has? All you're doing is trying to warp resume "triangles" to fit your agenda. World champs > gatekeepers mate.
Looks like you're skipping over parts of my reply to fit your agenda. I clearly said BESIDES beating Joshua, he's done nothing of note. He did beat Joshua so Parkers win over Ruiz gets a massive boost, but im not going to count Parker as a notable win for Joshua because like i said, besides Ruiz making Joshua himself quit, he has done nothing
I'm not skipping them over, it just isn't relevant to the point I was making. A win over Jennings is not better than a win over Ruiz, especially taking into account what Ruiz achieved. You can spin it eight ways until Sunday, but Ortiz's only claim to fame is a win against Jennings (and let's be honest, who cares) and losing to Wilder twice. Ortiz has never done anything else and would lose to Chisora at this point.
Im not sure where Wilders fanboys get their front to be honest! Here’s Deontay fight record, take a good look at the quality of his opponents and ask yourself how many of them had any ambition to get up off the canvass? Look at Wilders opponents in his 16th to 23rd fights and compare that with Joshua’s. Wilder has fought 3 men who occupied a rank inside the top 10 at the time of the fight, FFS THREE! THREE FFS! (Can I exclaim this any more to highlight that stat) One of those was ‘paper Champion’ Bermaine Stiverne who’s ranking was manufactured! Only 12 of Wilders 43 fights have been against an opponent inside the top 100 rankings 19 are Unranked and most of the rest are outside the top 300 or even 400 ranked fighters! Please, don’t anyone try and argue that Wilder is an ATG with that dross as a resumé! It’s embarrassing!! DEONTAY WILDER PROFESSIONAL FIGHT RECORD Fight Nō - Opponent - Rank at Time of Fight 1 - Ethan Cox - Unranked 2 - Shannon Gray - Unranked 3 - Richard Green - Unranked 4 - Joseph Rabotte - 393rd 5 - Charles Brown - Unranked 6 - Kelsey Arnold - Unranked 7 - Travis Allen - Unranked 8 - Jerry Vaughn - Unranked 9 - Ty Cobb - 399th 10 - Alvaro Morales - Unranked 11 - Dustin Nichols - Unranked 12 - Shannon Caudle - Unranked 13 - Harold Sconiers - Unranked 14 - Dan Seehan - Unranked 15 - Deandrey Abron - Unranked 16 - Reggie Penna - Unranked 17 - Damon Reed - 304th 18 - D Alexander - Unranked 19 - Daniel Cota - 489th 20 - David Long - Unranked 21 - Marlon Hayes - 368th 22 - Jesse Oltmanns - 492nd 23 - Owen Beck - Unranked 24 - Kertson Manswell - 310th 25 - Damon McCreary - 357th 26 - Kevin Price - Unranked 27 - Matthew Greer - 325th 28 - Audley Harrison - 136th 29 - Siarhei Liakhovich - 43rd 30 - Nicolas Firtha - 121st 31 - Malik Scott - 86th 32 - Jason Gavern - 194th 33 - Bermaine Stiverne - 5th - Wins WBC World Title 34 - Eric Molina - 37th 35 - Johan Duhaupas - 34th 36 - Artur Szpilka - 24th 37 - Chris Arreola - 43rd 38 - Gerald Washington - 41st 39 - Bermaine Stiverne - Unranked 40 - Luis Ortiz - 4th 41 - Tyson Fury - 4th - Draw 42 - Domonic Breazeale - 4th 43 - Luis Ortiz - 9th 44 - Tyson Fury - 1st - Lost by Knock Out losing WBC World Title 45 - Tyson Fury - WBC Heavyweight Champion - Scheduled
You're not grasping my point. Parker obviously has a better resume than Ortiz but in the context of using Parker to boost Joshua's resume, you should take Ruiz out of Parkers resume because Ruiz's only good win Joshua himself. It's like saying Ruiz is a good win for Joshua because he beat Joshua(lol) its stupid. And if you take Ruiz off of Parkers resume you get a gift decision against old Chisora(Parker should have lost) and a close fight against Takam. Whether thats a better resume than handling Prime Jennings in 6 rounds or not is up to you. Jennings went the distance with Wlad and gave him fits, the same Wlad that dominated Povetkin and the entire division for a decade easily. Im pretty sure Klitschko even that point would make Chisora and Takam his sluts like he did Pulev and Haye let alone an old Chisora. If you think beating Takam and getting a gift decision against old Chisora is better than Takam thats fine. We'll agree to disagree. Not that much of a difference to me anyway.
3/4 of Wilder's wins were not against a decent level of opposition but many were impressive with the manner in which he dispatched them. However, why does it even matter if he beat 30 low-mid level journeymen before he stepped up against Stiverne? Wilder started boxing at 20 and won an Olympic bronze before he hit 23; he was a super talent but with no extensive amateur pedigree. Knocking over journeymen increases confidence, killer instinct, fear factor, hype, experience and gives you time to mature and build your skills. There was a gradual rise in competition even before the Stiverne fight but the idea was not to rush Wilder, as America hadn't had a potential long-reigning champ in many years. KO'ing opponents adds physical and psychological wear no matter who does it but I can't see that Wilder ruins opponents more than other top fighters: Duhaupas went on to beat Helenius as did Washington, Szpilka went on to beat Wach and old Liakhovich went on to take Ruiz the distance. The last two were especially brutal KO's against fairly chinny opponents, so you'd have expected Wilder to retire them if your theory was correct.
You guys repost that list from time to time like it was the actual ratings. The guy who first posted this here admitted he just found it on another site and when I called him on it admitted he just started adding ratings himself from years later off boxrec, not ratings when Wilder faced them. Ratings the day he sat down and just decided to start adding them. I called him on it because I did a search on boxrec that day and YEARS later many guys had the same ratings they had that VERY day I called him on it. (LOL) It's made up. He admitted it's made up. And you and others keep posting and reposting it like they are facts. Are you posting knowingly bad information on purpose? Did you ever think to check if it was true before passing it along? Are those Ring ratings (because last I checked they don't rank 43 guys every month)? Are those boxrec ratings (because I know one guy here who said he added a bunch off boxrec years later, not when Wilder fought them? Are those WBC ratings? Whose ratings are they? You posted them. You insist they are accurate? You said Wilder only fought THREE GUYS in the top 10. Pull up the prefight reports or pull up the ratings from those months and prove those ratings. Otherwise, you're just another liar passing off bad information. Hell, Duhaupas hasn't won a fight forever and he's rated higher than that NOW on Boxrec. No wonder you guys don't get it. You believe anything you see that makes Wilder look bad. The ACTUAL ratings. (Note 12 title fights, 11 of the 12 are were in the top 10.) And his next title fight, the 13th title fight of his career, will also be against the WBC/WORLD champion, too. WBC January 2015 Ratings http://www.boxnews.com.ua/en/ratings/WBC/All/01-2015 Bermane Stiverne - #Champion WBC May 2015 Ratings http://wbcboxing.com/ratings/WBC_RATINGS_MAY_2015.pdf Eric Molina #9 WBC August 2015 Ratings http://wbcboxing.com/ratings/WBC_RATINGS_AUGUST_2015.pdf Johann Duhaupas #12 WBC December 2015 Ratings http://wbcboxing.com/ratings/WBC-RATINGS-DECEMBER-2015.pdf Artur Szpilka #8 WBC June 2016 Ratings http://www.wbcboxing.com/ratings/WBC-RATINGS-JUNE-2016.pdf Chris Arreola #9 (late sub for #1 Povetkin) WBC February 2017 Ratings http://wbcboxing.com/ratings/WBC-RATINGS-FEBRUARY-2017.pdf Gerald Washington #8 WBC October 2017 Ratings http://wbcboxing.com/ratings/WBC-RATINGS-BAKU-CONVENTION-2017.pdf Bermane Stiverne #1 WBC February 2018 Ratings http://wbcboxing.com/ratings/WBC_RATINGS_FEBRUARY_2018.pdf Luis Ortiz #3 WBC November 2018 Ratings http://www.maurowbc.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/WBC-RATINGS-NOVEMBER-2018.pdf Tyson Fury #3 WBC May 2019 Ratings https://wbcboxing.com/ratings/WBC-RATINGS-MAY-2019.pdf Dominic Breazeale #4 WBC November 2019 Ratings http://www.maurowbc.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/11/WBC-Ratings-November-2019.pdf Luis Ortiz #3 WBC February 2020 Ratings https://britishboxingnews.co.uk/blogs/wbc-release-their-february-2020-world-rankings Tyson Fury #1 WBC August 2021 Ratings https://wbcboxing.com/mailing/2021/ratings_pdf/WBC_Ratings_AUGUST_2021.pdf Tyson Fury #Champion (*Next Month) Wilders record in those 12 title fights is 10-1-1 with 9 KOs. Name all the current heavyweights who have had a DOZEN fights against top 10 heavyweights (who were top 10 when they faced them) and won at least 10 of them? List them all. Clown.
You're one of the few posters on this forum who I really pay attention to but the narrative around Wilder has become totally absurd. Even you have fallen victim to it to some degree, claiming that you thought Ruiz would beat Wilder or had an excellent chance. Unless Wilder is totally mentally broken and shot, Ruiz has a near zero chance against Wilder and the only reason why people typically argue otherwise is to protect AJ's reputation and diminish Fury. Wilder-Ruiz would be a carbon copy of Wilder-Stiverne 1, until it suddenly looked like Wilder-Stiverne 2 mid-late. Yes a healthy and active Fury stood Wilder on his head but if the fight ever gets made he will do the same to AJ and then everyone will have to re-evaluate where AJ and Wilder stand relative to each other. The Ruiz defeat tarnished AJ's resume because it wasn't just a horrible loss against a 25-1 weak fringe contender (who has since gone life and death with 40 year old, 18 months retired Arreola ffs) it makes the Parker win look worse (especially since Parker has performed terribly for a supposed ex-champ and top contender) and thus the Whyte win look worse (especially since he got terminated by a shot 41 year old Povetkin, went life and death with Chisora x2 etc.) Wlad already took care of a healthy and prime version of Pulev far more impressively and that was just a year before he got schooled by Fury, he'd also grappled and punched the cr*p out of a early 30's Povetkin in a non-competitive fight. AJ went life and death with 41 year old, 17 months inactive/retired, dethroned Wlad in Britain and would have lost if Wlad possessed real killer instinct. It's interesting that AJ has never been close to being the bookmakers underdog, suggesting a lower level of competition or mismatched opposition. Even Wilder, who I agree has been protected, has been close to even money on three occasions (Stiverne 1, Fury 1, Fury 2). Even since Wilder has been demolished by Fury, the bookies rate AJ-Wilder as a 60-40 matchup, not a mismatch as many pretend. Post-Ruiz, the idea that Wilder can use his length, speed and power advantages to land a bomb on stiff AJ's more fragile chin before AJ gets to him is very plausible.
