Would if George Foreman had decided not to turn professional? How much longer would have Smoking Joe Frazier's title reign would have lasted? And who would have finally dethroned him?
That's a good question. My gut reaction was to say that Muhammad Ali would have beaten him in their second fight which would have been for the title instead of a non-title fight. However, to my way of thinking, Frazier never seemed quite the same after Foreman destroyed him. If that fight had not happened there is a good chance he wins fight two at which point there may never have been a third fight. If there was a fight three I do think Ali, diminishing more slowly than Frazier, would have won. If they did not fight, then he made have made it to a fight with Holmes somewhere around 1977 or 1978. Of course he could have been upset by some lesser guy, these are heavyweights after all. Barring that upset Holmes seems like the guy.
Joe would have been champion until he met Muhammad Ali in a rematch. This would more than likely have occurred in early 1973. The FOTC two years earlier took more out of Joe than it did Muhammad,so I envisage it going virtually the same as their real life second fight with the exception being that it goes 15 rounds instead of 12. Ali UD Frazier by around 9 - 6 in rounds.
I’ll take this a different direction. After winning a gold medal in 1968, George Foreman decides to stay amateur and defeats Teofilo Stevenson in the 1972 final, battering the Cuban into submission in a Ron Lyle-type slugfest. He wins in 1976 in a rematch that isn’t as close as Teo avoids his power but doesn’t put up much of a scrap. Team captain George leads the USA to six golds in Montreal. When the USA boycotts the Moscow games in 1980, George retires, explaining that he had a vision after Jimmy Carter announced the boycott that God had a plan for him. He becomes an obscure preacher in Texas, ballooning to 400 pounds. In 1988, he makes a surprise return to the amateur ring and upsets Ray Mercer by controversial decision in the Olympic Trials, then cakewalks through the opposition in Seoul. In 1992 he defeats Felix Savon of Cuba when he lands a short right while behind with 45 seconds to go in the final round in Barcelona, shattering Savon’s mouthpiece in a Moorer-like KO. His final Summer Games appearance comes in 1996, where Savon outboxes the aging warrior for a decision in the Atlanta Games, where Joe Frazier lights the Olympic torch. Foreman retires as the greatest Olympian in any sport of all time, signs a deal to do infomercials for a countertop grill and goes on to bank hundreds of millions of dollars off the Foreman Gold Medal Grill.
Did a thread on this and the general reaction was Norton builds a lead before Frazier gets smokin' and starts landing bombs giving him a mid-late TKO/KO.
It could have been a battle of stablemates, Eddie Futch trained both, but as always, Joe Frazier stated he and Ken Norton were beast of friends, they would never fight each other. But I do like the question, I think that one of the boxing organizations, either the WBC or WBA mandates such a match, not like today where a champion holds out for the sake of drama or soap opera.
This might have had a bigger impact in the 90s to be honest. The title could have gone in all kind of directions, depending on who dethrones Moorer first.
@escudo Curious: what big-name professional boxers (contenders and/or champions) do you think Teofilo Stevenson is more famous than? I know there could be plenty, but are there any names that stick out to you, names that Stevenson is more famous than despite never fighting pro?
Not really sure how you'd measure something as nebulous as "More famous". I suppose youtube views is as good as any. His gold medal fights with Tyrell Biggs are his most viewed fights currently. The 2 videos add up to around half a million views alone. Compare that to say Mathew Saad Muhammad who almost none of his fights have more than 5 figures worth of views. So I guess it would be fair to say that currently more people have seen Teofilo fight than have seen Saad fight on youtube which lets face it, is where people watch classic fights nowadays. Especally when you get farther away chronologically and the internet gets even more ubiquitous world wide and views are tracked more consistently. That of course is only this one platform though and doesn't account for the highight reels and compilations and what not. But I would say with a decent amount of confidence more Cubans know Teofilo as their greatest heavyweight than would know Saad Muhammad despite being a lineal LHW champ in the pros.
@greynotsoold What say you, which pro boxers (contenders and/or champions) do you think Teofilo Stevenson is better known than around the world? My picks: Frans Botha, Brian Nielsen & Francesco Damiani. I believe Stevenson is better known than that trio and not only. What say you?
Frazier once said that if somebody had come up with the money than he and Ken would have fought. Especially if the title had been at stake.
Only Norton and Shavers could have potentially upset him and I'd favor Frazier over both men. That is, until the Ali fight
