How long before Ali recedes to being a #2 or #3 heavyweight, except for boxing hipsters?

You’re wrong (again) but this made me laugh.

 

David Haye was easily beaten by Wlad, the best big man he faced. So not a good example. Since 1997 the man regarded as the best heavyweight in the world has consistently been 6'4+ and 240 plus. Anthony Joshua is currently considered the best heavyweight in the world.

 

I don't see much evidence of a talent deficit. I doubt Michael Moorer or George Foreman would be able to become champion today. Moorer's lack of size and durability would be a big problem against Joshua I suspect.

 

Valuev proved that it's possible to have success as a plodding arm puncher if you're 7 feet tall and 300 pounds.

 

Louis and Ali are cemented as 1 and 2. You can flip them but nobody topples them. Louis still holds the record for most consecutive title defenses for any divisions 70 years after his last fight. And he lost years to WW2.
Ali - had two title reigns of 10 defenses also lost his prime years fighting and is the rare fighter (not unique) but rare that fought every type of style. Most fighters are guided away from a bad style for them or towards a favorable style for them. Ali it didn’t matter he fought every style there was. Jabbers, movers, swarmers, cuties, brawlers, southpaws, huggers, crouches, boxer puncher, etc etc.

 

Wait until you see Tyson Fury. Please promise me you'll be sitting down.

 

Have you ever.. watched a Boxing match? It might not hurt.

Here's a taste:

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You actually put Quarry below Shavers, Lyle and Norton!?!?!?!?

 

I was ringside for Fury vs Cunningham as I am for many fights. Try harder troll.

 

Then you know the punch the felled Fury would've slept Louis.

Louis struggled with a 23 year old kid who weighed less than 170 pounds. Can you tell me when Fury had such issues?

 

Sorry, you got shook, Karen. Would you prefer I ignore the facts?

 

I’ve accepted it as the natural progression of things. And when I say natural progression I don’t mean that “ new “things are necessarily “better”. It’s more about each generation viewing the contemporary as being the best. Sometimes it may be true and others not so much. It’s all perception. The youth of Dempsey’s era viewed him as being superior to men like Corbett, Sullivan and Fitz. The fans of Louis’s era did the same. It goes on and on and always will.
The way I generally tend to deal with it is to simply try and appreciate each individual for what they were and what they contributed. Head to head fantasy fights are fun but they aren’t necessary to determine greatness. Muhammad Ali WAS and always WILL be a great fighter in the minds of true fans and historians….. Casual contemporary fans may see it different. But screw them.. They’re like locusts. They eat and they leave..

 

So very true. I would add that fame is fleeting. So much fades into the background with the passage of time. Nat Fleischer and many of his contemporaries (who saw the old-itmers up through Foreman) rated Jack Johnson and Jim Jeffries as #1 and #2, respectively, or the other way around. Now it is not unusual to see neither Johnson nor Jeffries in all-time Top Ten lists. As far back as ten years ago when I was teaching in the university, I was surprised to find African-American students in my classes who did not know who Muhammad Ali was. Also, changing social viewpoints can have either a positive or negative impact on how a historical figure is remembered. Although Jeffries initially did not want to come out of retirement to fight Jack Johnson, eventually he did succumb to the pressure and took the bout for what today would be considered all the wrong reasons. And he lost. Today that is the fight for which he is best remembered and evaluated. I cannot help but think that his legacy would have been much better had he stayed retired and undefeated. And repercussions from the Johnson-Jeffries fight would extend far and wide, depriving such men as Harry Wills of a title shot. In turn, Dempsey's legacy suffers today because the Dempsey-Wills fight never happened. While attempts were made to stage it, there were powerful forces working against it which unfortunately prevailed. It would be interesting to look 100 years into the future to see how today's fighters are judged through the lens of 22nd century standards.