Is avenging a loss in a rematch not enough on it's own?

I agree with that sentiment.
Going with HW champions and beltholders, there was no reason for Lennox vs McCall and Rachman 3, there was no reason for Louis vs Schmeling 3, and there shouldn't have been a reason for Fury vs Wilder 3 either.

 

Depends on the circumstances.

With AJ/Ruiz it was for me always the case of AJ taking his eye off the ball and normal service was resumed in the rematch so a 3rd fight is kind of pointless, just as pointless as the 3rd Fury/Wilder fight, we know who's superior.

But if AJ were to somehow beat Usyk in the rematch I think a 3rd fight would be warranted because you wouldn't really know who was better as both at their best split 2 fights it wasn't a case of a fighter massively under performing in one fight.

Though I can see the argument that Ruiz under performed in the rematch, that's the only argument his fans have for a rematch but after the Arreola performance it's not an appealing fight.

 

It depends on what was shown in the fights. The point of rematches in this context is to prove the better man, if two fights don't do that, a third might be seemly.

Ruiz 1 involved Ruiz 'destroying' Joshua, knocking him down several times and stopping him.
Ruiz 2 involved Joshua fighting safely on the outside, jabbing with a huge reach advantage against an target that can't physically throw much back. He never hurt Ruiz, and it seemed it was more a physical mismatch than a show of superior skill.

Surely you can see why some feel that 'the better man' has not yet been concluded?

That said, I am not convinced Ruiz 3 will go differently. Ruiz might look to improve his mobility and sharpen his counter-punching, but all Joshua has to do is stay on the outside and he should have it in the bag. It isn't because Joshua is the better fighter, only because the physical matchup puts Ruiz at a significant disadvantage. This is why the third fight still seems uninteresting and unnecessary.

For Fury-Wilder, the third fight doesn't seem interesting because most don't believe there's anything to prove. Fury outskilled Wilder in 1; and outmuscled Wilder in 2. If Wilder wins again it almost seems unfair to Fury. Wilder only has to get it right for one moment and they've given him 12, 24, now 36 rounds to do it. If he does it doesn't prove anything, only that if you try it ad infinitum you'll eventually get it.

I am interested in Fury-Wilder 3 because of what it proves for Fury, not because of what it shows for Wilder.

To be brief:
-People want to see conclusively who is the best fighter, sometimes this takes 1 fight, sometimes a rematch, sometimes multiple rematches.
-If A's win is more decisive than B's win, a third fight may be appropriate
-If a fighter 'gets lucky' with a single punch, an injury etc. This is far less conclusive than a normal win, and a rematch is appropriate assuming the fight was otherwise at least even.

 

In other words when the fighter you like loses make an excuse and hope for rematch and if they win the rematch take it and run

 

Who has Joshua beaten that is better than Ruiz? Klitschko is the only name that I could say confidently, but they're from different eras. Bear in mind there are stylistic questions too, because Ruiz is limited by his physical traits there are plenty of styles that might beat him but it doesn't necessarily make them better boxers overall.

I don't think he needs a rematch largely because I don't think the physical match up makes it a fair fight, and Joshua shouldn't have lost the first really. Again though, I don't think this is thanks to Joshua's being 'the better man'.

So much that I don't think it needs a rematch, there is a fair argument that Ruiz is an equal or better fighter than Joshua. What he did in the first fight in counterbalancing the physical mismatch with superior tactics and counterpunching was more impressive than Joshua's simply using that mismatch to coast to victory in the rematch. I don't think it's conclusive, but the way we'd find the answer will probably have to be through their future resumés, as you implied, rather than through a third fight.

 

I mean does lack of motivation come into play there, like I just knocked you out and am forced to fight someone I stooped pretty easily for a second time it’s not necessarily easy to get that same energy back for all fighters. I mean let’s be real the 2 top dogs at HW have been Wilder and Fury AJ only has a title because of the mental breakdown Fury had after the first Wlad fight.

For me I’ll use Leonard Duran as an example 2 equally great fighters l, Fight I Duran moved up and wins in huge upset in what was the biggest fight and likely still is the biggest win in Duran career. Leonard rushes a rematch when he knows Duran isn’t focus got the win and stayed clear for years before facing an old Duran later on in fight 3..

AJ jabbing and running in fight II doesn’t prove he’s better especially when Ruiz whooped his ass badly in fight I while AJ merely survived fight II.
It’s an interesting one part of it is on the fighter to always stay focus and prepared, at the same time these guys know what they doing trying to rush the fight then tucking tail afterwards..
AJ-Ruiz will get brought up when discussing him simply because of how both fights went. Got his ass whooped then fought afraid afterwards.

 

How many threads you going to make on the same subject?

https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/does-anthony-joshua-owe-ruiz-jr-a-3rd-fight.671760/

https://www.boxingforum24.com/threa...-be-2-1-in-fights-against-an-opponent.673812/

I get that you’re young and probably still live at Mum’s with AJ posters plastered all over your box room, but seriously, this obsession is unhealthy man go take your ritalin and give it a rest jeeze!

 

Exactly. Wlad would beat Ruiz as I said but they're from different eras and the styles play a big role in this. Plus, that fight was close enough that it could easily have gone the other way, it wasn't a sound win for Joshua.

Povetkin is debatable. I'd like to see that fight honestly.

Parker, you already knew what I was going to say.

As such, I don't think Joshua's resumé tells you he's the better man. We'll have to see what both fighters bring in their future fights. I'm still very unsure as to Ruiz's level.

 

I'd say it depends on the situation. Two fighters splitting fights over competitive, entertaining fights? Hell yeah. Boxing has had some truly great trilogies.

But I don't feel that a fighter, upon losing to a guy, has to then beat them twice to determine who the better fighter is. I have never been a fan of AJ. Though he has had entertaining fights I think his personality outside the ring is as boring as they come, and I get irrationally annoyed when I see him stick his tongue out during a fight (pretty sure he did it in the last round Usyk....after getting his ass kicked)...but in no way do I feel he has to fight Ruiz again.

Did ruiz turn up horribly out of shape for the 2nd fight? Yep. Did it make the fight easier for AJ than it should have been? Of course. But it's not like people were sneaking into his bedroom at night and injecting jam into his veins. And as fighters and trainers have said countless times, boxing is mainly mental. If a guy over eats that's on him.