it's a straight question; can you prove me wrong? your reply isnt even relevant so much as it is a mechanism of escape
Played to the camera like no one else. Acted like the all American good guy while he was kicking the **** out of his then wife and doing lines of blow. Made a 30 30 documentary where he gets on a plane to Panama to visit Roberto Duran so DURAN could get closure about no mas. Phony *******.
You should see that 30 30 documentary. Cringeworthy. I couldn't believe my eyes and ears. It is worth sitting through that crap just to see what an ******* he is.
I actually saw it the other way around ,, Where it was Ray who was looking for the closure .. Never seems like Ray could get over it .. Duran was like " yay, what do you want? " ... I was in NYC partying after I took your belt ... lol .. Ray was looking for some big explanation or some sort of WOW moment on what happened in the rematch ..... and the only one is still / " plays " confused about it is Ray ... lol , I just read your post again .. you were being sarcastic .. haha ,,, agree with you 100 %
Leonard is in the top dozen or so ATGs, the only thing that bugs me is his Hagler "victory", which to me wasn't a victory. A step down from Duran and Hearns, probably a tiny step up from Mayweather.
I can’t see how the Norris fight can be used in any meaningful or justifiable way to detract from the prime or acceptably viable versions of Ray Leonard. Inactive Leonard was already a depreciated version of himself when he faced Howard in 84. He clawed himself back some when he faced Hagler in 87 but was still nonetheless that much less than he was pre first retirement. How could he not be - 1 fight in 5 years and by then, already 30 years old. Another period of inactivity followed before Ray strung 3 fights together, 6 months apart, v bigger but limited Lalonde and equally shop worn versions of Hearns and Duran. Each performance reflecting Ray’s own obvious and continued slippage. Then another period of inactivity (bad in any context but particularly poison for the ageing fighter) before facing Norris, with Ray closing in on 35 yo and Norris being 11 years his junior. From the outset, Leonard was clearly so much slower than his prime, hands and feet. It was obvious Norris’ advantage in speed over the very much depleted version of Ray would be the most defining difference, and it was. After the fight Norris himself said he expected Leonard to be faster but noted that Ray had slowed down.
To be fair to Leonard, he has never even denied that he waited for Hagler to decline, and it was the Mugabi fight that made him think the time had come. But surely Leonard deserves credit for being able to survive 12 rounds even with a declined Hagler after being off for 3 years. I had Hagler winning but Leonard's effort was more impressive than Marvin's considering the circumstances.
I started watching boxing as a kid first fight I ever saw was Holmes and Shavers, since then, my decent knowledge of lower weights goes back to the 70s sadly, heavies a bit further. What I will say is that SRL is the best I have seen in my era, skill wise, heart, boxing brains, the only one of the 4 Kings to hold a win (however questionable you see some of them) over the 3 others. No matter whether he beat, drew or lost to Hagler in that fight in your eyes ( I had SRL by a round or 2) nobody at that time pushed Hagler close. He isn't my favourite fighter by any stretch, its just in the time that I've followed the sport he's the best I've seen. If I'm on my deathbed and I've got to watch an hour of one boxer before I die. It ain't SRL it would be my hero Nigel Benn.
He didnt look depleted to me. I dont believe in making excuses. When Leonard humbled Duran, I gave him his due and in the same way, when it came time for Leonard to take his lumps, and was beaten in one sided fashion, we must give credit where credit is due no matter how it galls the blood. The reason Leonard looked so bad is because Norris was good enough to take him out of his element If Leonard LOOKED slow, its only because Norris had that kind of speed to make him slow in comparison Norris was not of the same sub par stock of opponents from Kevin Howard on and team Norris also had a game plan; what did you expect, for him to fight Ray flatfooted like Dave Green? Like Don Lalonde? Ray was HARDLY inactive leading up to the Norris fight. These SRL fans will spin things any way they see fit