Champion s That Cleaned Out Their Division - Avoiding No one?

He never fought Ottke, who was his biggest rival.

 

You are correct. Hagler DID avoid Graham in order to fight Leonard, I don't think anyone here disagrees with you. The important thing is that Hagler did not 'duck' Graham (which would suggest that Marvin was afraid of losing). That is what may be confusing.

 

No, I don't believe either he or his management thought he would lose to Graham. But did they think that there was at least a perceivable risk that it could happen and scupper the dream fight against Leonard, a risk they had no inclination to take because of how much there was to lose? Quite possibly, or perhaps even likely, seeing how there should have been enough time to make it happen before the Leonard fight. He had previously fought four times a year as a champion, so two times shouldn't have been a problem.

I don't think that the fight couldn't be made, more of a "who needs it?". A quick, tricky fighter that didn't bring much money and no legacy when the sights were set on that huge Leonard payday... Why take the chance?

 

I think Sumbu Kalambay would of been more dangerous than Herol Graham, he actually beat Graham convincingly and almost knocked him out in the last round.

Just out of curiosity how highly was Kalambay rated prior to beating Graham ?

 

I think it's as simple as Hagler deciding if he wanted to fight again and if so who against - Hearns or Leonard? Hagler - Mugabi and Hearns - Schuler were tune ups for their proposed rematch and Hearns was offered an incentive deal to get Schuler out of their quickly and impressively to raise interest in said rematch. IMO is Leonard didn't come out of retirement Hearns may well have been his last fight.

I don't believe Graham was on his radar whatsoever. It was Leonard or Hearns or perhaps both IMO then adios.

The public weren't clamoring or interested in a Graham bout and no-one thought he had a semblance of a chance. He;d beaten next to nobody.

Now if it was a few years earlier Hagler would have obviously found time to fight Graham but he was at his end game.

 

Yeah, could be.

 

Just going from memory here, but Leonard started talking about a comeback for Hagler just a week or so after the Mugabi fight. I think negotiations started soon after. If I wasn't so lazy I'd double check this, but assuming the deal was reached a few months after Mugabi.... don't know if it effectively precluded a fight in the interim, but that should pretty much have been the plan.

With the deal being at least negotiated pretty much right after Mugabi there wouldn't be much, if any, room for another fight. If I remember correctly. So, yeah, reconstructing the timeline as I remember it, it's difficult to see how another fight would fit in, even in those 11 months.

EDIT:

From Boxrec

• Leonard decided to challenge Hagler after watching his fight with John Mugabi on March 10, 1986. "I was at ringside, sitting with Michael J. Fox," Leonard said, "We were sitting there having a few beers, and I'm watching John 'The Beast' Mugabi outbox Hagler. Of all people, John 'The Beast' Mugabi. Now, I had had a few beers, and I said, 'Michael, Michael, I can beat Hagler.' And he said, 'Ray, do you want another beer?' I said, 'Yes I do, but I can beat Hagler.' "
• On May 1, 1986, Leonard was interviewed on WDVM-TV in Washington, D.C., and made his desire to come back and fight Hagler public. "I know exactly what it takes to beat the man," Leonard said. At the time, Hagler was vacationing on a private yacht in the Caribbean. Hagler did not comment on Leonard's challenge until July 2, when he held a press conference and said he was considering retirement and didn't know if he would fight Leonard or anyone else.
• On August 18, Hagler announced that he would fight Leonard, and the fight was officially announced at a press conference at the Waldorf-Astoria Hotel in Manhattan on November 3, 1986.

Faitly close to how I remembered it. Talks must have started as soon as Leonard made that announcement.

 

For sure. I don't think Hagler was remotely interested in any other fight than Hearns and when Leonard said lets do it Tommy was cast aside for obvious reasons.

 

I suppose you've never heard of Marvin Hagler, but he was around during Monzon's reign, and never got a title shot until after Monzon retired, despite being a rising star...
Not that we should have expected Monzon to hang on forever taking on new challenges, but I wouldnt make the claim that he cleaned out his division when there were ruthless maniacs like Hagler running around at the time

 

Jones, Tyson early on, Ali, Holmes, Lewis, Usyk, I will list more if they spring to mind

 

Was gonna say Felix Trinidad he pretty much cleaned out Welterweight. Then I remembered Quartey was one chip left on the table.

 

Mike Tyson.

 

Also Joe Luis Lopez and Page.