Dan Bucceroni 1950’s heavyweight contender

It proves a fighter has been well managed imo. It also raises questions as to why his manager is so cautious .

 

Here are Roland LaStraza's last nine opponents prior to challenging Marciano for the heavyweight title:

Ted Lowry-------63-61-10
Dan Bucceroni-----36-2 (loss)
Bill Wilson-----43-16-2
Ralph Schneider-----16-5-2
Joe McFadden-----5-3-1
Dan Bucceroni-----38-2
Rocky Jones-----14-8-2 (loss)
Rocky Jones-----15-8-2
Rex Layne-----40-5-2

Total record 270-110-21 Winning percentage of 67%

Here are George Foreman's last nine opponents prior to challenging Joe Frazier for he heavyweight title:

William Scott-----1-2
Leroy Caldwell-----11-9-1
Ollie Wilson-----21-39
Luis Pires--------18-7-1
Joe Gordwin-----1-14-1
Clarence Boone-----3-25-2
Ted Gullick-----15-5-1
Miguel Paez-----48-15-13
Terry Sorrell------4-15

Total record 122-131-19 Winning percentage of 45%

LaStarza's opposition looks like a murderer's row compared to Foreman's. Five of Roland's fights were against top ten men. Even the weakest, McFadden, was coming in off a draw with Nino Valdes.

So why was Foreman's management so cautious?

Foreman ended up blowing out the undefeated Frazier in two and is generally considered a top ten all time heavyweight.

 

So your position is if a challenger faces soft opposition that absolves another challenger from doing the same?
Name the five fights Lastarza had against top men?
Was it against Lowry who had won2 of his last 20 fights and had lost his last 8?
Was it Simmons who had won 1 of his last 6?
Was it Wilson who had won 1 of his last 4?
Mitchell who had lost his last 3?
Felton who had lost his last10, 7 by ko?
Spagnolo who had won 3 of his last 9?
Schneider who had won1 of his last 3?
Perhaps Kennedy who had won his last 2 over men with records of 2-4-0 and 3-5-0?

 

Great Post Suzie! Nice to see you on top form!

 

"So you position is if a challenger faces soft opposition that absolves another challenger from doing the same?"

No. My point is that facing soft opposition doesn't prove one can't do well against better or top opposition. Foreman is one case. Marciano another.

"Name the five fights LaStarza had against top men?"

You must mean before he challenged for the title.

1----Rocky Marciano
2----Rex Layne
3----Dan Bucceroni
4----Dan Bucceroni
5----Cesar Brion

If your list of easy opponents supposed to condemn LaStarza?

Curt Kennedy--25-4-1 going in. Had won 5 of last 6 and 8 of last 10. Had wins over Charley Norkus and Duilio Spagnolo.

Duilio Spagnolo--20-7-3 going in. Former Italian champion who was also New England champion. Had wins over Luigi Musina and Bernie Reynolds. Had won his last two and would beat Charley Norkus in his next fight.

Vern Mitchell--55-12-2 going in. Yes, he had lost his last three, but all to top ten men. Had wins over Cesar Brion and Perk Daniels.

These three men would have been rated Class A fighters by The Ring in their yearly rankings. Class A was the 30 or 40 men coming next after the rated fighters. Would mean you were top fifty worldwide. Are these first tier fighters like Layne and Bucceroni? No. But they are not exactly pushovers either. Sort of worthy second tier men.

 

I would think that most times fighting or competing against weaker competition would be an advantage. Less wear and tear on a person or a team. Tough sparring, tough fights, etc. wear a fighter down, a fighter is going to experience some tough fights and sparring regardless, but the less the better IMO.

 

Kennedy
Sagnolo
Mitchell
Were trial horses.I'm not condemning anyone ,I'm stating a fact Lastarza was very carefully matched and kept away from the iron of the division ,by that I mean men like.
1949 Ranked men
Charles
Oma
Thompson
Walcott
Woodcock
Satterfield
Valentino
Agramonte
1950 Ranked men
Louis
Savold
Maxim
Henry
Baker
Walcott
Gardner
Oma

1951 Ranked men
Charles
Henry
Sys
Louis
Baksi
Baker
Williams
1952 Ranked men
Walcott
Charles
Dunlap
Henry
Sys
Bivins
1953 Ranked men
Valdes
Walls
Cockell
Henry
Harrison
Satterfield
Wallace

In his career Lastarza beat 1 ranked heavyweight ,Layne whom Marciano had ruined.


You mentioned Foreman? By my count he fought 13 fights against ranked heavyweights.

 

This raises an issue. I went through the Boxing Register put out by the Hall of Fame about Hall of Fame fighters. How many rated men did some of these men defeat before challenging for a title:

None

Miguel Canto
Pipino Cuevas
Khaosai Galaxy
Fighting Harada (for the Kingpetch challenge)
Lew Jenkins
Carlos Monzon (had not beaten a rated fighter until he fought Benvenuti. Then ran up 15 such wins)
Terry Norris
Carlos Palomino
Pascual Perez (drew with Sharai, then beat him for title)
Carlos Zarate

One

Carmen Basilio (for the Gavilan fight Only Billy Graham)
Jimmy Carter (only Wallace Smith)
Victor Galindez
Ingemar Johansson (only Eddie Machen)
Nicolino Loche
Barry McGuigan
Ken Norton (only Ali)
Aaron Pryor
Salvador Sanchez
Jose Torres (Bobo Olson)

Two

Carmen Basilio (for the DeMarco challenge. Billy Graham and Pierre Langlois)
George Foreman (Chuvalo and Peralta)
Joe Frazier (for the Mathis fight. Only Bonavena & Chuvalo)
Max Schmeling (Risko & Uzcudun)
Randy Turpin (Delannoit & Yarosz, and then he defeated Sugar Ray Robinson)
Tony Zale (Al Hostak, Ben Brown)

It is perhaps surprising how many Hall of Famers and champions didn't defeat a lot of rated fighters before fighting for a title and becoming champion.

As for LaStarza, as far as I can see looking at The Ring yearly rankings (not monthly) and the NBA quarterly ratings, he had fought 5 and defeated 4 before challenging Marciano. He lost to Marciano on a split decision. He defeated Brion (who was rated by the NBA) and Layne of the heavyweights, and Bucceroni and Jones of the light-heavyweights. Bucceroni quickly moved up to heavyweight and was highly rated in that division over the year after losing to LaStarza.

Certainly not outstanding, but far from the least qualified challenger on this basis either.

 

You compared Lastarza's record to Foreman's not me! If you wish to expand on that, I think it merits another thread and it could be an interesting one!
NB Lastarza beat 1 Ring ranked fighter his whole career!

 

okay. I am busy now, but when I have the time I will start a thread comparing the opposition of Foreman and LaStarza up to the time they challenged for the heavyweight title. I think it is interesting to compare them.

"LaStarza beat 1 Ring ranked fighter his whole career"

Layne at heavyweight. But Bucceroni was the #4 ranked light-heavyweight, and Jones the #9 ranked light-heavyweight.

I think dismissing rated light-heavyweights back then is pretty arbitrary considering how Moore, Johnson, and Satterfield did against the big fellows.

Also, Bucceroni and Brion appeared in The Ring heavyweight rankings for long stretches.

 

I have his match with Aaron Wilson. He looked decent in that..

 

2 lhvs.

If a lhvy beats 2 ranked middleweights how much credit do you give him for that? Bucceroni and Brion were not ranked when he beat them. The crucial bit is WHEN ?

Lots of people beat Ezzard Charles ,but WHEN did they do it?

 

Okay. How much credit do you give Tommy Loughran for beating Harry Greb and Mickey Walker?

Weights in fight in which Loughran defeated Greb (Greb-168, Loughran 166)

Weights in fight in which Loughran defeated Walker (Walker 165, Loughran 173 1/4)

Or how much credit should Archie Moore get for beating Bobo Olson?

Weights in fight in which Moore defeated Olson (Olson 170 1/4, Moore 175)

This raises the issue of when a man who can make the middle limit fights at a higher weight in the light-heavyweight division, should he be considered a middle, or a light-heavy?

Same with fighters like Satterfield or Bucceroni who were rated light-heavyweights but fighting above 180 consistently.

 

"WHEN"

It is important if the fighter is young and green, or old and washed up and losing to everyone.

Neither was true of Brion or Bucceroni. Brion was 24, had a 25-2 record, and I think you are wrong that he wasn't rated. He was rated by the NBA and I think in the monthly Ring ratings. He lost his Ring rating when he lost to LaStarza. But whatever, I don't think this is a big point, as he would go on to be rated as high as the #7 contender by The Ring, and the #6 contender by the NBA and to defeat several name opponents.

Bucceroni was 25, had a 38-2 record, and was the #4 light-heavyweight contender. He weighed 181 for LaStarza. He went into the 2nd LaStarza fight 41-2 and would go on to defeat rated heavyweights, such as Jimmy Slade and Tommy Harrison, and was actually rated for one month as the #1 heavyweight contender by both The Ring and the NBA.

What about Tommy Farr and Max Baer? Baer was not rated by The Ring or the NBA in 1936 and 1937. Farr defeated him in early 1937. Does this mean that the best Farr can be credited with is beating an unrated opponent? That is nonsense. Baer was a former champion and would get back to the #1 contender rank. He was easily one of the top ten heavyweights in the world regardless of being unranked at the moment and also easily one of the most dangerous punchers out there.