Canelo is like Mike Tyson

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Thunderstorm, Jul 14, 2022.

  1. Johnny1987

    Johnny1987 Active Member Full Member

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    Why do you think Bivol & Floyd fights were razor close? Are you Stevie Wonder?
     
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  2. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    See this topic to answer your question about why Mayweather Canelo was razor close :
    https://www.boxingforum24.com/threads/scoring-mayweather-canelo-with-a-special-guest.687973/page-2

    Bivol was "razor close" on the judges cards, because Canelo did well in 5 of the rounds. Bivol emerged as the clear winner to the fans, but it was still razor close on the cards because boxing is scored on a RBR basis. The rounds Bivol won were more one-sided than the rounds Canelo won. That's how Ward beat Kovalev the first time. The rounds Kovalev won were more one-sided than the rounds Ward won, but Ward won more "close" rounds than the amount of one-sided rounds Kovalev won.
     
  3. Staminakills

    Staminakills Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    No true boxing fan would ever believe this nonsense.
    Both Tyson and Canelo are ATG, fact.

    they always fought the best and won most of them.
    Canelo truly has 4 losses
    Bivol
    GGG x2
    Mayweather.

    losing all very competitive fights makes for a fat career and he’s still going strong
     
  4. Philly161

    Philly161 "Fundamentals are the crutch of the talentless" banned Full Member

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    Ah yes the guy who has never been down and has 2 decision losses (and some controversial decision wins and draw) is just like the guy who was knocked out in every loss he had except the one where he bit his opponent.
     
  5. Rollin

    Rollin Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Canelo is a ginger dog and a disgrace to the very sport he claims to love.
     
  6. ConfusedGuy

    ConfusedGuy Member Full Member

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    @shadow111

    Don't feel like answering this then?

     
  7. ShovelHook

    ShovelHook Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    He's never been schooled? Bivol and Floyd didn't school him at all? GGG even schooled him quite a bit.
     
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  8. exocet76

    exocet76 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Appeal to authority you daft gimp.
    Nobody cares what the judges think in a Canelo fight as everybody but you knows they're paid off and corrupt.
    Yes a fight is scored round by round and Bivol outlanded Ginger in every round.
    You got levelled in the last thread and you ran away when you couldn't even convince anyone that Canelo won even the first round.
    Yet here you are now trying to pretend it was close...it wasn't remotely I scored it 11-1 for Bivol and the vast majority of normal people scored it a round either side of my score which is reasonable.
    Mayweather also clowned him making him look clueless.
    So you can spin and use fallacy logic all you like most people know better.
    Ginger was completely schooled in two fights and clearly lost to GGG in another two.
    Some might say he also lost to Trout and Lara. I thought he did enough in those two fights to win but they were competitive at least.....
    Bivol. Mayweather and the first GGG fight were not...
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2022
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  9. Reppin501

    Reppin501 The People's Champ Full Member

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    This is one of the most idiotic threads that’s been posted here, and that’s saying a lot.
     
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  10. Ph33rknot

    Ph33rknot Live as if you were to die tomorrow Full Member

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    Yes dig the pepe avi
     
  11. Johnny1987

    Johnny1987 Active Member Full Member

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    I watched both fights, Canelo got schooled. Good for him though, the last time he got schooled he got better. So maybe this Bivol defeat can do the same for him. By better i mean, he started taking banned substances and went on a rampage. He needs to double up his portions of that dodgy meat he’s been eating
     
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  12. C.J.

    C.J. Boxings Living Legend revered & respected by all Full Member

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    You obviously never saw the Bivol fight He made Ginger look like an amateur. Ginger lost to GGG TWICE too but Vegas judges saved his butt
     
  13. C.J.

    C.J. Boxings Living Legend revered & respected by all Full Member

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    Bivol /Canelo CLOSE ?????? Now you've gone from sublime to the ridiculous ROFL!!!!
    Look at their records Even with all the "help" from judges & Mexican meat The Ginger Nutt still has MORE losses than GGG
    Bivol kicked his ginger butt.
     
  14. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    115-113 x3 isn't close? That's as close of a score that you can get to a draw without an even round.
    Please, GGG has never fought anybody as good as Mayweather or Bivol, besides Canelo of course who he's winless against.
     
  15. shadow111

    shadow111 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    The short answer is, no I didn't think Chavez deserved a draw against Sweet Pea, but it's been a long time since I watched PW vs Chavez. Comparing PW vs Chavez to Floyd vs Canelo is an interesting comparison, as far as deciding which was closer. Since it's been a long time since I watched PW vs Chavez, I would need to rewatch and re-score that one before I can say for certainty which one was closer. But given how close I know Floyd vs Canelo was, I would have to say that from what I remember about PW Chavez, in my mind Floyd Canelo was much closer. I mean how many rounds do people realistically think Chavez won? What's the maximum amount of rounds that you think it's justifiable to give to Chavez against Sweet Pea? When I look at Floyd vs Canelo, there were a lot of close rounds that could be scored to Canelo, which I demonstrated when going over the first 6 rounds. But, that said, Floyd was landing more jabs on average. So a lot of people aren't going to give Canelo rounds when he's being out jabbed even if though he lands the better power shots.

    Even Markus the OP in that Floyd Canelo topic gave Canelo 2 of the first 6 rounds vs Floyd (rounds 2 and 4), and aside from that he concluded that two other of those first 6 rounds (rounds 1 and 5) that he gave to Floyd were close. Now we disagreed strongly about rounds 3 and 6, but his view of rounds 1, 2, 4, and 5 were pretty spot on. The point is, whether you had it 4-2 Floyd after 6 as he did, or 3-2-1 Canelo like I did, that's a close fight after 6 rounds. It's pretty ridiculous for anyone to deny how close the first 6 rounds were. Then you add in all the Floyd fouling and dirty fighting in round 4 and round 6 particularly, the blatant fouling that Floyd did, which I detailed very thoroughly with those clips from Round 6, that's another reason to give those rounds to Canelo. I gave very strong reasons for why Canelo deserved to win round 3, and round 6 I put together several clips detailing Canelo's work, including shoulder shots landed, shots from a fan cam that show shots landing that were hard to see from the Showtime cameras.

    You're trying to make a parallel between PW Chavez and Floyd Canelo because both decisions were rejected by the fans. (PW Chavez being a draw, one judge scoring Floyd Canelo even) What happened to CJ Ross being exiled from boxing for her card is unethical in my view. Yes I disagreed with her card, more than just her scoring it a draw, but which rounds she gave to Canelo many of which I disagreed with. But to exile her from the sport for that card was wrong. I agreed Floyd did enough to win, but you could find 4-6 rounds to give to Canelo. Namely rounds 2, 3, 4, 6, and then 10 and 12. 8 and 9 were also close. (Canelo was winning round 8 after 2 minutes, but lost it imho in the final minute) Round 9 was a very close round, really a toss-up for me. So while I agree it's a stretch to score that a draw, and I have no problem with Floyd getting the win there, the fact is that it was a lot closer on a RBR basis than many fans want to admit. Whether it's due to Canelo hate, whether it's due to fans attached to Floyd's nuts, fans just refuse to see that fight for what it is. Canelo did a lot of good work vs Floyd. It wasn't enough to get the win, but it was not the Floyd domination that people make it seem. With PW Chavez, I think you had very favorable scoring for Chavez as he was a legend and he was so used to winning, they gave him a lot of rounds, and he was the aggressor in many rounds which fans like, even though he wasn't landing as clean or as effective as Sweet Pea.

    Chavez has a good poker face and influenced the judges by his come forward approach, even when he was getting hit, he never gave the impression he was hurt or bothered by Sweet Pea's shots. Chavez was far more seasoned and experienced when he fought Sweet Pea than Canelo was against Mayweather, but Chavez was also older, past his prime, and more shopworn. Canelo had youth, speed, and power vs Floyd than Chavez had vs PW, but Canelo was weight drained so he was lacking in concentration at times, he also wasn't as good at slipping shots or rolling with punches back then. When you talk about Floyd Canelo being one of the most widely lambasted scorecards in a major fight of the last few decades, that's true, but the reasons for that are because a judge scored it a draw and the fans saw a clear Floyd victory. The outrage over it was way over the top and similar to the 10-2 Byrd card in Canelo GGG 1, the fans were upset over one judge scoring it wrong, but the overall result (Floyd winning, Canelo GGG 1 a draw) is perfectly acceptable so there really shouldn't be controversy. PW Chavez being a draw was far more suspicious because you had not just 1, but 2 judges scoring that a draw when the public saw a clear Whitaker win. Also important to note is that the 2 judges who scored it a draw had it 115-115, which meant they each scored 2 rounds even 10-10. And not the same rounds (one judge scored round 9 and round 11 even, the other judge scored round 3 and round 12 even) 3 of those rounds that were scored even (3, 11, and 12), the other judges gave those rounds to PW. Round 9 however the other 2 judges gave to Chavez.

    The press scores were:
    Associated Press scorecard: 116-112 Whitaker
    Newsday scorecard: 116-112 Whitaker
    Ring Magazine scorecard: 117-111 Whitaker
    Sports Illustrated scorecard: 117-111 Whitaker
    Washington Post scorecard: 115-113 Whitaker

    The Washington Post had it pretty close, the same score as the judge who scored it for PW. All the press scores had it relatively close reall, but that's understandable given the respect and admiration people had for Chavez, you'd expect the press to have been more willing to give him a close round or two and keep it close So did Chavez receive favorable scoring there? Yes I think you can say that, but it's understandable as he was an established legend who was 88-0 going into the match.

    The press scores for Mayweather Canelo on the other hand were all over the place :

    Associated Press scorecard: 119-109 Mayweather
    ESPN.com scorecard: 120-108 Mayweather
    RingTV.com scorecard: 116-113 Mayweather

    Now, the AP and ESPN scores are embarrassing, but RingTV had it quite close at 116-113. That right there shows that if you really wanted to, you could score almost every round for Floyd, or you could score 4 rounds to Canelo plus 1 other round even as RingTV did. That's the kind of fight it was. You had about 4 or so rounds that were clear Floyd rounds, then you had about 2-3 rounds that maybe looked like Floyd edged but could be arguable for Canelo. Then you had about 4-5 rounds that were good Canelo rounds that you could argue he edged. There weren't any rounds that Canelo really dominated or anything, but there were a lot of close rounds that could go either way. So you could easily just auto-score every round for Mayweather giving him all the close rounds if you aren't paying close attention as the AP and ESPN did. RingTV obviously saw it much closer. That wide range of press scores has to do with expectation and bias. Mayweather was P4P #1 was a much bigger name than Canelo at the time, and was fighting in his hometown. Chavez was a much bigger name than Whitaker, and a legend, so it makes sense for Floyd and Chavez to get favorable scoring in the press like that.