Will Usyk vs Joshua be for the vacant lineal belt?

Oscar has a deal with DAZN. DAZN televising Joshua-Usyk. DAZN has no deal with Fury.

Now, Oscar's magazine says Joshua-Usyk is for the lineal title. And DAZN's announcers will be hyping it as such.

Nothing to see here. Move along.

Ring Magazine has just become the fifth alphabet org.

 

People act like Fury was held at gunpoint and forced to declare retirement. He chose to say it, unprompted! He's had months to walk it back.

He's not a kid, he doesn't need bubble wrap to protect him from the consequences of his own words.

Last time he was gone for several years. Meanwhile AJ, Wilder, and Usyk (in another division) were out fighting, winning and defending belts, putting damage on their bodies, and sustaining the sport so there was something for him to come back to.

If he says he retired, then he retired. If he wants to play games that's fine, but we can't have the rest of the sport play his game for him. Make it cost something.

 

Tyson Fury was never lineal for me, as Wladimir Klitschko was never lineal for me. Vitali didn't vacate his WBC title until after the Wladimir Klitschko vs Alexander Povetkin fight. Wladimir & Vitali should have then been considered numbers 1 & 2 in the division. When Wladimir fought Chagaev it was #1 vs #3, that is not lineal for me

 

Heavyweight Lineal title list from 1885-2022.

https://boxrec.com/wiki/index.php/Lineal_Heavyweight_Champion

How Klitschko became lineal title holder.

https://www.si.com/boxing/2012/11/1...gid=ci0255c887200824a5&pid=wladimir-klitschko

 

Chagaev was #3 entering that fight, lineal is supposed to be between the 2 top rated boxers in the division

 

Klitschko was champ when he beat Povetkin

 

#1 vs #3 is not lineal for me

 

They aren't idiots, they sought clarification from him about his championship status.

He told them in no uncertain terms he's never fighting againif a man says he's retired, and gives up his championship claim, he's no longer a champ.

AJ and Usyk are the best two unretired heavyweights on the planet.

One of your biggest criticisms of AJ has always been he's never fought for the lineal title, well now he is doing.

 

Povetkin was number 2

 

What about Larry Holmes?
Or Marvin Hart?
Or Sugar Ray Robinson?

 

@Rumsfeld - get in here and drop some knowledge bombs

 

Lineage is and always will be in the eye of the beholder.

And in this day and age, it is and always will be contentious.

Take the notion. When Lewis retired, Vitali was seen by everyone as the number 1 HW in the world until he retired. During this whole time he was classed as the WBC title holder. The man had a belt around his waist, a number 1 ranking with every publication and was making championship money.

Now some will argue, he never beat Chris Byrd so he was never lineal champ. The problem is, it's only some arguing that. Had the WBC said they'll only recognise the winner of Vitali vs Byrd as champion, then the fight probably happens. Had every publication said they'll only consider Vitali as champ if he fights Byrd, the fight probably happens.

But as it is, both guys had a title, Byrd had his victory in the bag, Vitali had his ranking in the bag.

Lineage is great, and it's pure, but it's not something to get overly obsessed with (I say this as someone who is absolutely overly obsessed with the notion of lineal champions).

When people become absolutely entrenched with 1 v 2 or faux retirements, they do so largely from an point of ignorance historically speaking across every division.

The winner of Usyk vs AJ will be recognised as the champion. They'll be calls for the winner to fight Fury, just as there was when Frazier was champ, and Charles was champ and Johnson was champ and Vitali was champ and Holmes was champ etc. But the key is in the title, those guys, just like the winner here, would be the champ.

 

Tyson Fury yesterday "in retirement".

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Once again, anyone (including the staff at Ring Magazine) who thinks Tyson Fury is retired hasn't been paying attention.

 

No, the current staff at Ring Magazine are idiots.

Do you know how many times Muhammad Ali told Ring Magazine in interviews he was retired during his second reign in the 1970s?

Too many to count. Basically after every fight.

Tyson Fury has defended the World Title TWO TIMES SINCE Usyk and Joshua last stepped in the ring.

Fury will probably fight yet again before the Joshua-Usyk winner gets in the ring again.

This smells.

It'll smell even worse if the Ring drops the Joshua-Usyk winner in the championship slot and then has to rank Fury again the Monday after the fight.

"Well, we didn't understand his retirement talk was just hype (even though the rest of the world did) and we made a move" is going to be difficult for them to walk back.

 

There's no such thing as the lineal belt.