GGG is overrated.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Austinboxing, Nov 5, 2022.



  1. surfinghb

    surfinghb Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    what an asinine thing to say , ,she got suspended .. ALL judges are responsible for turning in an accurate depiction of the fight best as possible... this was a SCAM .... didnt say the fight wasnt close

    Wilder didn't get robbed against Fury ,, another brilliant analogy
    My whole POST and argument is based on GGG getting his due win(s) per the consensus over Canelo .. SO have no idea why you choose to continue to quote me thread after thread ... You really only deflect anyway and have nothing to add so ......
    Its absolutely amazing to see the bottom feeders , consensus wise , that go on and on and on about how JLC won the fight against Mayweather ....yet when GGG CLEARLY out points Canelo more than JLC out pointed Mayweather ... people cant understand the basic concept of the popular guy getting pushed thru, BOXINGS MONEY MAKER... its the same ****ing thing here ... SAME SAME ......

    The only correct thing you can add .... .. you just solved the puzzle ... you're learning ...great post here
     
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  2. Man_Machine

    Man_Machine Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    I don't know about Golovkin pulling under 100K in PPV buys but, to speak to your point, HBO budgeted low for Golovkin's PPVs (allegedly forecasting 150K buys - which, if true, is pretty terrible) and were justified in doing so, since he did approx 160K for Lemieux and 170K for Jacobs.
     
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  3. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Sorry I don’t subscribe to your ‘right’ opinion, lol. But just because you see it a certain way doesn’t make it that way.

    One judge was way off. The other two had it very close (one had it even). So yes it was a terrible card but it doesn’t invalidate the result. Throw out that judge’s scorecard and you still have one even and the other 7-5 in rounds, which means swinging one close round makes it even).

    I think you can reasonably get to a draw without any gymnastics. A robbery would be if one guy won 9 or 10 rounds clearly and none of them close enough to swing to even or the other way.

    Just because you don’t like the result doesn’t make it wrong. Even if the majority of people agree that a close fight should have gone to one fighter, if it’s close and there’s enough rounds that could swing that way to make it a draw then that’s a reasonable result.

    And yes, GGG’s resume is similar to Wilder’s. A lot of defenses but most of them against lower-tier opposition and didn’t come out on the right side in the one big series he had.
     
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  4. surfinghb

    surfinghb Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    SURE IT DOES .. thats the point of a consensus and a VAST MAJORITY AT THAT
    AKA robbery
    no mental gymnastics needed, no draw here, just a popular fighter gettin pushed thru
    little complex for you
     
  5. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    This has nothing to do with what fighter I like. Obviously you take personal offense at the result because of a rooting interest. It seems to have you very agitated at the thought that the result wasn’t a robbery.

    A close fight is never a robbery. It’s a difference of opinion.

    You don’t dispute that it was close. A 7-5 fight can swing to draw or the other way on a close round or two. There were close rounds.

    Yeah, more people saw it GGG’s way. That doesn’t mean that is the ironclad, only possible conclusion.

    Sorry your guy lost.

    You seem very agitated. Relax. People are allowed to not see things the way you do and not be idiots — or maybe you’re one of those people whose opinion in always “right” even though it’s an opinion? Or I guess you see it as the world is full of idiots and you’re the only smart guy out there, lol. Must be a frustrating life to be that guy.
     
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  6. surfinghb

    surfinghb Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    he aint my guy at all .. just calling it like it went down .. Im objective poster as it gets ....
    you are the one who continues to quote me from thread to thread and engage with me
    Ive stated that GGG is around the 10 spot ... is that ****ing far off dude??
    80% plus consensus isnt a close draw ... same as Greb should have walked away with the title against Tunney in their second ,, A VAST MAJORITY .. is my point
    so I rate GGG accordingly ... why is that so hard for you to understand ..
    He clearly out pointed a Prime MW tough as nails Canelo who has POWER .. so give him the credit he deserves
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2022
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  7. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I’m not quoting you from thread to thread, lol. You posted something here and I replied to it as I’m doing here (after you quoted me haha). Probably as many of my posts are replies as not. If you don’t want people to reply to you to engage in conversation, why post? Is it just stating your almighty opinion and none shall ever dare say they see it differently.

    I know you know this, but fight results aren’t based on ‘well 80% saw it this way.’ Who are those 80% by the way? Where are you coming up with that number? And even if that’s true, if say 75% thought he won but thought it was close, say one round away from a draw, and thought some of the rounds were close … then a draw, again, is reasonable. They don’t award draws on an evenly split 50% court of public opinion ruling.

    I didn’t in any way challenge where you rate him. You can rate him No. 1 for all I care, or No. 100. But I am not curious since you base so much of this on one result vs. Canelo, where do you rate Alvarez at 160? I mean, he beat the guy two other times and the last one wasn’t really close. So is he ahead of GGG in your “Mr Objective” opinion or do you somehow find a way to dismiss those real results too?

    As for trying to take away credit for GGG … where did I do that. All I’ve posted about is that a draw is a reasonable result one can get from a close fight, which the first meeting was. But I see why you’re so hung up on it — if he doesn’t get a win over Canelo there’s no foundation for your high rating of him, so you had to give him a fight he didn’t actually win.

    Cleverly non-objective of you.
     
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  8. surfinghb

    surfinghb Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    ok SP
     
  9. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I know you think you’re an important person and your opinions are fact, but I quote a lot of people. You’re not that special to me.

    If you don’t want to see my replies to your posts, whenever they happen to occur, put me on ignore. That way you won’t see them.
     
  10. surfinghb

    surfinghb Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    ok thanks
     
  11. Boxed Ears

    Boxed Ears this my daddy's account (RIP daddy) Full Member

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    Gaydarbek Abdulovich Gaydarbekov.
     
  12. Man_Machine

    Man_Machine Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    This overrating thing does not seem to be good for one's health.

    I wonder - If we were to compare a list of those, who predicted a Golovkin victory over Canelo, pre-fight, with those who actually thought Golovkin won, post-fight - would there be a correlation? I'd wager there would be...

    Wasn't there a 'consensus' view that GGG would win by KO? I seem to recall it being that way, before he and Canelo faced off.

    I guess overrating Golovkin has had some damaging side-effects, e.g., impacting one's ability to objectively score fights and accept results in matches that one did not expect to be so closely contested, but were.

    I mean, it must have been frustrating for the backers of this alleged 'killer' of the ring (GGG), to watch him be made to look fairly ordinary in real-life, unable to do what he usually did to the relative non-entities of the division.

    What then is the answer?

    "
    This content is protected
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    Yes - it has really gotten to be that tragic!
     
  13. surfinghb

    surfinghb Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    care to tackle this @ChrisJS
    and what happened to the other chris? Chris805 ,, that dude knew his boxing and was a solid poster .. havent heard from that guy in a while but always respected his knowledge
     
  14. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Here’s an interesting way to look at the first fight.

    Take the two judges not named Byrd and this three-judge panel Dazn put together to judge the fight, watching together in real time (not as it happened live, but as in you start the tape while all three are watching and they judge each round and let it roll til the end).

    That’s five judges.

    Out of those five, there were only four rounds that the judges all agreed on the winner. Three of those are for GGG and one for Canelo. The rest at least one judge was different from the rest (sometimes more).

    That means out of 12 rounds, a panel of five judges (two professional scoring it live as it took place and three boxing journalists who scored it watching together after the fact) ended up with eight rounds where there wasn’t unanimous agreement.

    The three Dazn judges all scored it for GGG, but the point is there’s eight rounds in that fight where reasonable judges trying to seriously score the fight that could have swung either way. That means a card of 11-1 GGG is possible or a card that’s 9-3 Canelo. Or somewhere in the middle, which is where the fight landed.

    https://www.dazn.com/en-US/news/box...st-canelo-ggg-fight/sf5ldhda2gya1vvmp4gtsvndj
     
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  15. ChrisJS

    ChrisJS Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I think he’s overrated by many of his fans but underrated by his unreasonable detractors.

    He had a lot of quality as a fighter, good jab, power, great chin, heart etc; but he wasn’t without limitations such as his defense and lack of world class speed but overall, his absolute prime, head-to-head he might do better in hypothetical matches than he does on an all-time ranking.

    When corruption and clear bias is involved I tend to not always agree with only scoring official verdicts much like I give Whitaker the Chavez win and Lewis is 2-0 vs. Holyfield, I count Golovkin as having beaten Canelo at least once and the third fight doesn’t really count as he’s clearly washed up. He was avoided by Canelo in his better days, Martinez, Sturm, Cotto etc; he’d have beaten them but he didn’t so I can’t give him those wins but I can judge him on the best opposition he faced and he wrecked a lot of guys and was consistent and active. They weren’t great fighters and I thought he was underwhelming vs. Jacobs and I don’t think Canelo was this special fighter so there’s not a great deal to judge Golovkin on at the highest level. His best three opponents - Jacobs, Canelo, Derevyanchenko- he beat them all but didn’t show himself to be special in those fights IMO.
     
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