What if Muhammad Ali had retired in 1975 ? Part 2

That could have been an interesting turn. Shavers ends Norton's reign, then Holmes ends Shavers' reign. Norton and Holmes probably end up fighting for the title at some point, and who knows how that one turns out, their one match having been too close for me to call another one anything but a toss-up. Maybe they end up with a trilogy, especially if Holmes loses the first.

 

The aged version of Ken he faced at least. I have a hard time believing, Shavers beats the Norton of the first two Ali bouts.

 

Very good point.

 

Looking a little more closely at the timeline put forth by the OP, with Ali retiring in January 1976, it’s a three-horse race: George Foreman, Joe Frazier and Ken Norton. Well we know what happened when George rematched Joe in ‘76 and nobody (presumably including Ken) was screaming for a Foreman-Norton rematch.

The next tier is Shavers and Jimmy Young. We know what happened when George fought Young, but with Ali out of the way and Foreman holding the title belt again … where is George’s head at? Is he feeling invincible, convinced himself that the Ali loss was a fluke? Does he fight Jimmy a bit earlier, and is it in the sweltering heat of Puerto Rico, or is it an indoor fall showdown … and does that matter?

Let’s say George gets by Jimmy … we probably get Foreman vs. Shavers in the biggest showdown of pure power punchers maybe in heavyweight history.

That would have been some dynamite.

I figure either Earnie does what Lyle couldn’t and becomes champ when he sledgehammers George into submission or, more likely, George wins and by this time Larry Holmes is on the scene and ready to make his move. I think Holmes is a bad matchup for Foreman and he wins.

 

Also two other things in Norton's favor in a prime for prime scenario is he would be much younger and more importantly wouldn't have that devastating loss to Foreman which ruined his confidence, particularly against punchers.

 

ESB Holmes is a bad matchup for Foreman. I agree.

Real life Holmes who struggled with his rather mediocre opposition probably doesn't fare to well.

 

This is exactly how I see it, without the Leon Spinks farce.

 

Ferdie Pacheco said he observed Muhammad Ali had some neurological slurring of words after the first Joe Frazier bout in 1971 and said after Manila in 1975 Ali could have retired but " the real cut off place was [Ken] Norton in Yankee Stadium " in 1976 he left a year later after the Earnie Shavers fight in 1977.

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I don’t know what he said later, but at the time he left Ali, Ferdie said he was worried about kidney damage not anything neurological.

 

It's mentioned in Johnathan Eig's biography of Muhammad Ali. Pachecho also spoke about Ali's kidney's in Thomas Hauser's book too.

 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/...ing-toll-boxing-took-on-alis-health-rtlcwg6hf

"Pacheco said he saw signs of lasting brain damage after the Frazier fight in 1971. He said he told Ali to quit after that fight."

 

In one respect it would have been better if he had never come back from that exile. He might have been able to retire healthy (though that depends upon how much damage had been incurred by that point). Of course if he had it would have been a massive loss to the sport and fans but for him personally better.

He was not the same fighter and started taking punishment from fights and in training.