Why did more old time small fighters KO bigger guys in the past?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Blofeld, Aug 8, 2023.

  1. Blofeld

    Blofeld Active Member Full Member

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    OK this maybe totally wrong but it seems the dusty history books are filled with small but mighty guys beating the cr*p out of behemoths sometimes 20 times a week. Barbados Joe Walcott, Sam Langford, Mickey Walker, Harry Greb, Bob Fitzsimmons, even Jimmy Wilde, even though he never made it to heavyweight (as far as I know!) are fabled for KOing guys many times flabbier.

    Then after about 1920 this seemed more of a rarity and only now with the advantages of PEDs do we see a few more giant killers.

    Is this just the nature of history that the legends are remembered but there were no more giant killers in the 1900s than at any other time, or has it become harder to do due to heavier guys getting that much bigger? Or are the average decent larger guy simply better than the sailors, circus strongmen and truckers Langford blasted?
     
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  2. kingfisher3

    kingfisher3 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    the talent pool for hw's is the main reason imo. look how average japanese height shot up once the kids had proper nutrition.

    the money available at hw was a real incentive for good guys to move up and that hasn't been a thing for 50+ years..
     
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  3. Greg Price99

    Greg Price99 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    It still happens. Duran, Holyfield, Pacquiao and Usyk have all beaten world class boxers far bigger than them.
     
  4. Pugguy

    Pugguy Ingo, The Thinking Man’s GOAT Full Member

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    Perhaps smaller and more “likely” better skilled small guys beating or at least being competitive with significantly bigger guys is a natural phenomenon to a degree but such match ups are simply not seen as often in more modern times.

    Sure, in the more modern era, we’ve seen smaller fighters move up through several divisions with incrementally increased weight in tow and despite the extra weight, that is still a vouch for the smaller men.

    However, match ups involving notable size differences back in the day seemed to involve more smaller fighters staying in and round their most natural weight - though of course some carried more weight later in their careers as a natural consequence of ageing.

    Langford’s weight appears to have jumped up somewhat around the early to mid teens - I don’t know if that was deliberate weight gain to compete better with larger opposition or just Sam putting on a few extra pounds anyway.

    Usyk has done great at about 220 lbs against considerably heavier and dimensionally larger opposition. If he were to try come in any heavier, it could well upset the fine balance of P4P attributes relative to weight that he brings to the table.
     
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  5. Bronze Tiger

    Bronze Tiger Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The big guys weren’t as big
     
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  6. InMemoryofJakeLamotta

    InMemoryofJakeLamotta I have defeated the great Seamus Full Member

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    Yeah but no 185 pound fighter (in the ring on fight night at 185) has recently KO'd a 220+ pound fighter. Hasn't happened in decades and Holyfield was over 200 pounds when he beat his giants.
     
  7. Greg Price99

    Greg Price99 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    No, that won't happen due to the nature of the current weight divisions. If one of the contestants is 220lbs+, it's a HW contest, so the other won't be under the modern 200lbs CW limit.

    Whilst rare, there are modern examples of fighters KO'ing bigger fighters with that same 35lbs+ weight disparity, though . Wilder has multiple such examples, including consecutive stoppage victories over fighters who were 138lbs (surely that's the biggest weight disparity in history where the smaller fighter won by stoppage) and 49lbs heavier respectively. Admittedly neither were world class.
     
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  8. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 MONZON VS HAGLER 2025 Full Member

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    A 185lbs fighter isn’t actually allowed to fight at HW anymore. You have to weigh over 200lbs.
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2023
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  9. Sailor Joe

    Sailor Joe Member Full Member

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    A lot of good reasoning here. I think the biggest thing is just opportunity to do so though. Modern weight divisions don't allow the kind of weight disparity between fighters.

    If we look at early MMA (90s), there were few weight classes, and quite a few smaller guys were able to get wins and over much bigger men (Sakuraba, Yuki Kondo, Frank Shamrock, Frankie Edgar, BJ Penn all good examples of small guys with wins over bigger guys).
     
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  10. Sailor Joe

    Sailor Joe Member Full Member

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    I actually feel like Wilder is perfectly suited for this. He's got the length of modern heavies, but the speed of a cruiserweight (which most guys his weight would fight at). I think he'd actually have done worse in boxing if he'd chosen to be a career cruiserweight. He'd lose out on a lot of his explosive advantage over guys at 200 pounds.
     
  11. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Smaller gloves.
     
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  12. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Necessity.
     
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  13. RockyJim

    RockyJim Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Marciano's highest weight was 189 lbs...(In case you wanted to know)...
     
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  14. Reinhardt

    Reinhardt Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Excellent point...