Anthony Joshua vs. Francis Ngannou •

They would get murdered in the UFC.

 

Let's not forget Ngannou has had about a year of boxing training. Give a top level boxer for example AJ a year of wrestling training and I'm not so sure they do get murdered in the UFC. Most fights in the UFC do start with punches lets not forget that either. I enjoy watching mma but I often call the fighters a jack of all trades master of none.

 

And the UFC guys get murdered in the sport of boxing.

 

Banned for opinion, I am glad you have no power in real life. If you were politician you would have me shot against the wall because I said something against your fanboyizm

 

Depends on the stylistic match ups. I wouldnt be surprised at all if in a year AJ could develop enough defensive wrestling skills to force guys like Ngannou, Lewis, Rozenstruik, Gane, Tai etc to stand and trade with him, but then the actual good grapplers like Jones, Aspinall and Jailton would still get him down and sub him without much trouble most likely. Bearing in mind HW is a relatively one dimensional brawler heavy division these days as well.

Its an overplayed stereotype really. That UFC event PPV last weekend had an olympic medallist TKD guy, a high level karate guy and an ADCC champion on it. The next UFC PPV has a guy who was probably the best kickboxer ever at his weight, a super high level former collegiate wrestler, and one of the best female boxers ever vs a two time olympic medallist judoka.

 

lol!

 

One of the best female boxers ever?

 

Murdered is a stretch, plenty of boxers have no punch power so they wouldn`t murder top UFC fighters, having said that mainly the toughest, most robust boxers make it to the top because boxers take more blows than MMA fighters, top MMA fighters don`t seem to have or need great chins to become champ which is why so many of them get sparked by one shot and why Francis` power had more effect in the UFC than it did in his boxing matches, he actually caught AJ with several counter hooks before switching southpaw, I think he was hoping for a break. As if it would take Joshua a second to feel comfortable attacking his line. Ngannou is just so STRONG, but not coordinated.

 

There are some boxers who aren't known as major punchers in the context of boxing. But their punches would have a lot of effect on a normal person and certainly would also have effect on somebody like you said perhaps an MMA fighter who isn't used to taking punches. For example Floyd Mayweather stopped Conor McGregor. Floyd who hadn't scored many knockouts of late, was in his 40s and was essentially coming off the couch. Floyd was the snappier puncher in that match, And in the final two rounds Connor was gassed and the punches were becoming more effective from Floyd.

 

Conor just got tired, he didn`t look too bad for the first few rounds, he`s a very quick fighter but he movements were too explosive and naive.

 

Floyd allowed that in my opinion. When ever Floyd started taking things seriously he bothered Conor.
McGregor's punches were pushing shots with no snap on them which actually surprised me.
I understand he got tired, that's the thing. When you get tired of course as we know it's easier to get stopped.

 

I respect all these views and discussions, but let's be real. Let s go back in the calender year 2007:

- Vitali and Wlad Klitschko would have defeated K-1 dominator Semmy Schilt and MMA dominator Fedor Emelianenko in boxing,
- Schilt would have defeated the two Klitschko's and Fedor in K-1,
- Fedor would have defeated the two Klitschko's and Schilt in MMA.

And anyone who sees it otherwise is simply not realistic. Sure some upsets can happen, but if a top guy is in his field in a good shape (what Fury wasnt against Ngannou), there is less to nothing to do for someone from an other field.

Combat sports which involve kicks have a complete different range as boxing for example. The fighters stand usually more away from each other, there is more room.

Some people say if the fight is not on the ground, the boxer would always win. Really? Would AJ beat a prime Semmy Schilt in an K-1 fight? Schilt ist 6'11" tall weighing around 280 lbs, and he was incredibly skilled with his height. He used his body to his full advantage, long range jabs, very strong kicks and devastating knee strikes.

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Or what would happen if Jones starts to kick AJ, Fury, WIlder etc. to the knee caps like this:

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Bruce Lee once said the longest weapon of a human being is a low kick to the knee, the longest weapon to the nearest target, and that s the way it is. A leg is stronger and longer as an arm, and when i see this clip here from Jones, i say Wilder s skinny legs wont take 3 of these kicks before it's so much damaged that he goes down.

Fury has also very thin legs and i doubt he can take many kicks. Especially the knee cap is as much vuneralbe on any human being, dont matter how big, small, thick or thin you are.

I mean i like boxing the most, but now saying like AJ vs Ngannou in the octagon would be 50-50 or even AJ the favorit is weird.

Be it David Haye, AJ himself or Tony Bellew, they all said in an octagon the MMA guy wins. And especially Bellew is usually not so humble, Haye only some times.

Carl Froch said not long ago if he would fight McGregor in the street, he would bite him (advice from B. Lee too when grappling comes into play). I would tell Carl against McGregor it would maybe work since he is not a world class grappler. But if Khabib would get a hold on Froch, i dont think he will be able to bite him, Khabib is too skilled in grappling.

And so or so:

Dont matter if now or 1 year ago. To me Bones Jones is the Nr. 1 MMA HW in the world and not Ngannou. I am very sure Jon would beat Francis.

 

Jone Jones (a boring guy with an extreme deficit in charisma) actually also has skinny legs.
Lucas Brown, Dillian Whyte, Shannon Briggs, Butterbean, Ray Mercer to an extent etc All had it in their capacity to somehow deal with leg kicks. If somebody gets the training then I think we extrapolate from that. I don't think we can make an accurate prediction by suggesting that for example Wladimir Klitschko would go into an MMA fight without having any training in it. I assume he's bright enough to brush up on some of the other disciplines before going into this hypothetical fight. I assume that about essentially all the boxers we have mentioned here.

 

I'm not so sure of that. MMA regularly attracts top level grappling talent as it's about the only decent paying professional sport where they can ply their trade. Both Pride and UFC have had Olympic medallists from judo and Greco Roman wrestling compete in their ranks, and almost from the off the UFC was attracting some really high level former collegiate wrestlers.

Regarding the initial part of your post Joshua would not only have to learn how to defend against takedowns but how to defend against kicks, knees and elbows, and dirty fighting in the clinch. One year is not enough time to do that.

 

Yeah but there is a major difference:

Classical Muay Thai kicks aiming for the thigh. Francois Botha was also able to take these kicks even if he said they hurt him very much. He gave the K-1 Champion Remy Bonjasky the hell of a fight in late 2004, and imo this fight here was a draw after 3 rounds and should have go to an extra round:

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10-9 Botha
10-9 Botha
10-8 Bonjasky
= 28:28 draw, but they gave it to Bonjasky

These classical kickboxers and karetekas like Bonjasky, Peter Aerts, Ernesto Hoost, Andy Hug, Mirko Cro Cop etc. used muay thai kicks to the thigh, and that's the kicks Brown, Mercer, Briggs, Butterbean etc had to deal with.

But these guys didnt use these french savate kicks that Jones is using. They are aiming for the painfull and vunerable knee cap, not to the more massive and tougher thigh.

The knee cap is much more vuneralbe as the thigh. And dont matter who you are or how big, small, thick or thin you are, the knee cap has the same vunerability.

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Since muay thai was so popular in the 80s and 90s, it seems many MMA fighters still think these roundhouse kicks to the thigh are the most effective kicks. But they should ask themselfs why people like Botha, Mercer etc could take them so well without being hurt so much. The answer is simple: Because they arent so effective even if the look cool.

The thigh is the second strongest muscle in the whole body since they are basically the base to hold your bodyweight up when standing, running or walking, only the muscles of mastication are stronger as the thigh.

Jones found that out and prefers these savate knee cap kicks over the muay thai thigh kicks, and the success gives him right. He only lost once, and this was a DQ throgh ilegal ellbows, so it wasnt really loss.

Like punches to the head should aim for chin/jaw or temple, not for forehead or cheekbones. Kicking to the thigh is like punching to the forehead, both areas are very tough and can resist much. But temple, chin/jaw and knee cap are weak spots.