I agree Usyk won round 1, but he didn't win it due to Ring Generalship. Fury was actually trying to be the Ring General that round, though he wasn't as effective at being the ring general as he was in rounds 4-6, he was still seemingly in control that round for more than Usyk was. However Usyk landed the better punches in that round which is why Usyk deserved to win the round. Ring Generalship is really only used as a deciding factor on who wins the round when the landed punches and the quality of the punches were even. That round, Usyk's landed punches were better, so Ring Generalship wasn't a deciding factor that round. Also Fury's clowning at the end of round 1, while funny, was excessive and didn't lead to any landed punches like it did in other rounds. While Fury was in retreat for most of the early rounds, he was the one throwing more punches. It was Usyk who was being economical and trying to set up punches. Fury was blocking well and evading shots. Fury gassed after 6/7 probably partly because of all the movement he was doing and the fact that he was throwing more punches than Usyk. Usyk conserved his energy a lot better, Fury tried to be a showman in the early rounds but it did tire him out. I just rewatched Round 4. Fury clearly won that round. In Round 4, not only was Compubox in Fury's favor in overall punches 16/48 to 13/41, but Fury out jabbed Usyk 5-2 and landed a significantly higher % of power punches 50% to 36.7%. So Fury outlanded him that round, but not only in total punches landed, not only landing at a higher %, but he also outlanded him in terms of impactful punches. Case in point #1 : This content is protected (timestamped 30:32) Flashy uppercut landed on Usyk right on the chin. "Lovely shot there by Fury." Now in the other topic I also pointed to the lead rights that landed for Fury as a result of clowning, one is right after that uppercut at 30:41, hands down, catches Usyk with a lead right across the face. And the right hook to the side of Usyk's head at 31:04 as a result of Fury clowning him on the ropes. Each of these shots were clean, impactful eye catching shots. What did Usyk land in this round that could compare to any of these punches? Your argument that Usyk won this round doesn't make sense. Take a look at the slow-mo clips at the end of the round, this one in particular. This content is protected (timestamped 32:07) Fury's lead straight right blocked by Usyk, but then Fury follows up with the left hand that catches Usyk directly on the forehead. ". . .the fluidity of his work." These are numerous examples of Fury landed hard, clean, eye catching, impactful shots. Usyk didn't land anything as good as these punches. So not only did Fury land more punches in the round, not only did Fury landed a higher %, including a significantly higher % of power punches, but Fury outjabbed Usyk by 3 landed punches, and clearly landed the more impactful and eye catching shots. And he landed some of them while completely clowning Usyk which is high level Ring Generalship. Fury 4 was Fury's round, no doubt about it. He completely schooled Usyk that round on many levels. Usyk looked completely out of it this round and just totally perplexed by Fury's style. Of course it was close, your Usyk's biggest cheerleader, scoring Round 4 to Usyk is your most glaring indefensible position. Rounds 2 and 3 were also very good rounds for Fury, which I just rewatched. Fury landed the most flashy eye catching shots in rounds 2 and 3, aside from Usyk's good one-two at the start of Round 2. While you can make the argument for Usyk in 2 and 3 (certainly moreso than 4) those were each good rounds for Fury and without a doubt close rounds. The argument you have made that Usyk clearly won rounds 2 and 3 is utterly delusion and is evidence that you are hugely biased in favor of Usyk. I agree Usyk won, but not by the margin that you are trying to argue. It was an extremely close fight. 114-113, maybe 115-112 if you're generous to Usyk. 116-111 or 117-110 is Usyk fanboy territory.
Shadow you can quote me as much as you like, but i don't do discussions with mentally ill people. Told you, that you are ignored and will be unignored. I gave you all the chances in the world in the past to have a proper discussion, and you showed that you are completely biased and clueless. You are emotional person with mental problems that needs help, visit a doctor man. You will always be remembered for : "Canelo won, because he landed more shoulder punches and biceps shots." "I gave Fury the Ring Generalship, as he was clowning and showboating." P.S. Shadow111 and all of his alts account which are plenty.
You are a sore little man. Your boy was smashed around the ring and the referee heped him. You are beyond help, as you are clueless when it comes to Boxing. You were chatting absolutely dog**** how Fury will make it easy and will stop Usyk. How Ngannou will KO AJ, how Ngannou had a granite chin, and AJ can't hurt him, and all that waffles. You are the one that needs help, as you are still in denial, after the beating your boy took. I was one of the few person on here that predicted how the whole sage will plays out long ago, with all of the Fury ducking of AJ and Usyk. And i predicted how the fight will plays out as well. So you can still dream that this fight was a close one, or whatever. It's funny how Fury fanboys now try to argue with the Boxing Rules and the Criteria, as they have nothing to say. So happy Turki paid for the Live Stats with the AI, so Fury fanboys delusion to be over once and for all. As we all know they are serial liars, and even when Usyk outland Fury clearly and land the better punch, they try to lie, that it was the opposite. Based on their delusion, Fury needs to one just 1 good shot, and they can ignore all of the Usyk work, and will score the round for Fury. Now with the AI, you can't do that, as everyone going to laugh at you. Mod should start ban trolls like you, that says nothing on the thread topic, and just try to poke and provoke people. Your last 10+ posts are just quoting me on trying to get a reaction. This just prove you are a sore looser and has no life, other than trying to troll and provoke. If you wanna say something constructive about the fight, go on. If you don't like my posts and can't live with seeing them, ignore me instead of chasing me all around. And look at your life, and don't tell other people what to do with their. Cope harder.
Yeah, this is why boxing is subjective and I agree with lots of your points. I think it was a close fight as well, and I've rewatched it a few times, and I think it depends on what you personally prefer. For me, boxing isn't a game of tag, and if you take the first 3 Rounds, starting with Round 1 for instance, although Usyk does land some very clear shots to Tyson's body, they have very little impact and he's basically just touching him, and although they count towards something, I think to believe he wins the round simply because of those types of shots, is pretty weak evidence. I do give Usyk the first round however, but for me the deciding factor was the left cross he landed, with like 16 seconds to go, which was a very impactful shot, and in a round where very little happened, I feel like moments like that, are enough to win the round for him. Round 2 was different however, with it definitely being an Usyk round, and with him throwing far more impactful shots. He starts off with a nice one two, where he catches Tyson with a jab followed by an impactful left cross, and then goes on in the round to catch him with more body shots, though this time with force, and there was a moment where Usyk gets Tyson against the ropes and catches him with a nice three punch combination. Tyson did get more into the round as it went on, using his jab and catching Usyk with a few nice heavy body shots, but it definitely wasn't enough to win the round for him. Round 3, is very close I think. Usyk starts off with two body shots to Tyson's stomach, but again, they're the weak tapping kind, with very little impact. Tyson then goes on to catch Usyk with a nice stiff impactful jab to the face, then another later on when on when backing up into the corner of the ring. Usyk does catch Tyson with a few more body shots, but again, they're very weak shots, besides maybe one or two. Usyk did catch Tyson with a solid left hand again in the round, but Tyson caught Usyk with a right hand later on, that was even more impactful, then followed not long after, by a quick one two combination. Usyk did try to get a flurry off after this, but Tyson just negates it, clinches and then manages to catch Usyk a few times when coming out of the clinch. For me it was Tysons round, but again, it's subjective, if you score Usyk's tapping shots to the body as impactful shots, then you could give him the round, but for me Tysons shots were just far more effective and damaging. After this, I think the fight was very easy to score. Tyson won 4-7. Usyk won 8,9,10,12. With Tyson winning 11. So I score it 114-113 to Usyk. Both fighters winning 6 rounds each, but the knockdown and 10-8 round being the deciding factor. Tyson definitely won Rounds 4-7 in my opinion, and I don't see how anyone could argue otherwise. He was the one in control, landing by far the more impactful and damaging shots and Usyk for me, just wasn't being effective at all. Maybe you could make it 115-112, if you gave Usky Round 3, but I think you have to be very generous to do so, with his punches just lacking impact in that round.
And here where your bias clearly kicks in. Firstly Round 11 was a clear Usyk round. You have to be mental to give this round for Fury. Even Warren who is the most biased and deluded out there gave it to Usyk. Fury landed absolutely nothing in that Round, except for 1 patty jab, and 2 body shots, and Usyk landed 4-5 clean left head shot to Fury head, 2 big right hook, and huge jab that staggers Fury for a moment, and Usyk landed a huge Left Straight to Fury head to finish the round. And Usyk was chasing Fury around the ring + landing body shots that i don't even need to counter, as this Round was so huge. Hard to take you seriously based on this alone. So how exactly and on what criteria you can give Round 11 to Fury? Both in AI and Compubox Usyk outlanded him big time, especially in power shots. You are talking about Impactful punches, well 51 to 23 for Usyk. In every single Round outside of the 5 and 6. Usyk outlanded him in both landed and Impactful ones. Funny how you saying that Usyk left hand to the body is touching punch, when clearly was not and was landing full force, but somehow scoring for Fury when he land his patty arm jab that has nothing behind it. Funny how Usyk strong hand, which is his left, which he landed power shot to Fury body all night, was just "touchy" punches, yet 99% of Fury clean landing punches was exactly body punches. His work to the head was anything but impactful and was mainly arm punches and messy shots, mostly behind the head in the clinch, which are illegal and not scored. His best work is Round 5 and 6, with the 2 uppercuts in the 6th. How exactly you going to say one guy power punch is a touchy one, and the other hand you show a clear bias for the other fighter, as most of the Fury shots was the body one. You are saying impactful, well i can tell you that Usyk body punches was to slow Fury down and to make him lower his guard, which was clearly the case, aka the punches to the body plays it's role perfectly, as Fury did slows down, and Usyk did find Fury head constantly, as he didn't know where he punch will go body or head. Usyk body body also put Fury on the back foot and allowed him to score at will on Fury. Not even going to argue about Round 3 and 7, as they were Usyk rounds. Cleaner, better shots, more impactful ones and the stats shows it. You can nitpick and lie about anything, but that ain't helping your case. Saying this or that punch is touchy we can say the same for Fury arm punches, which was most of his shots anyway. Most of his work in landed punches to the stat was in the clinch, when he can't land full force or even close to that punches. His jab has always been a weak arm punch as well. And the resto f his work, was 2 uppercut in the 6th. and body punches, which you already say are "touchy" ones. LoL.
Good points, I scored Round 1 to Usyk, Round 2 to Fury, and Round 3 to Fury, but I was very conflicted about Round 2. Scoring Round 2 to Usyk is very justifiable. I scored Round 7 and 11 to Usyk, and I gave Round 12 to Fury, but we end up with the same score of 114-113. The reason why I gave Round 7 to Usyk is because of how he finished the round with an incredible series of punches, but on the other hand Fury controlled the first 2:30 of Round 7 and was certainly winning the round heading into the final 30 seconds. Round 7 for me is a toss up round because of how impressive Usyk was in the final 30 seconds. Round 11 could certainly be argued for Fury, but again Usyk (as he did in Rounds 7-10) came on strong in the last 30 seconds which in my view was enough to edge him the round. But Fury was doing quite well for most of that round. Round 12 while Fury was outlanded did land some flashy eye catching shots and for the first time since Round 6, finished the round well, so I gave it to him. So while we differ on a number of rounds, and I would disagree with you that rounds 7, 11, and 12 were easy to score, you scoring the rounds as you did in my view are prefectly reasonable and you've explained why you scored as you did. In the end we both had it 114-113 Usyk which is consistent with how close the fight was overall.
Compubox had Usyk outlanding Fury "big time" in Round 11? FYI Compubox had Usyk outlanding Fury by a only a single punch in Round 11. It was Fury 12/32 37.5% to Usyk 13/33 39.4%.
Round 11 was a clear Fury Round. I don't know what you were watching, and I don't care what the likes of Frank Warren think, that counts for nothing, I've watched it myself numerous times, and that's how I'm basing my decision. I'll even watch it now and break it down for you. So, okay, Round 11, Usky immediately comes out, misses with the right hand, then follows it up with a left that bounces off Tyson's shoulder. Then Tyson clinches him, and after the clinch Tyson goes back to standing at range from Usky. Usky then throws a very light body shot that lands, but again, it's one of those tagging punches, yeah he hits, but it has zero impact on Tyson. Tyson then throws a light jab to Usyk, hard to tell how much impact there was, but this was also a light soft punch. Tyson then throws another light jab. Usyk at this point is just waiting. Tyson throws 3-4 jabs, none really hitting, but he's applying pressure. Then he hits Usyk with a body shot, another light shot. Usyk again is just waiting. Tyson then throws a few feints and another jab. And then another, then Usyk tries to counter, first with a jab that makes marginal contact with Tyson, who moves back, and then a left cross, that Tyson steps out of range of, it maybe makes the barest of contact, but any impact of it is gone. He then goes for 2 more punches, both missing, with Tyson using great defense and footwork to get out of the way. Usky then goes for another left cross, and Tyson blocks it with his forearm, and Tyson counters with an uppercut that I think connects, though the TV angle here was a bad one. Usyk then tries to counter with a left, and again hits Tysons shoulder. They clinch and Tyson lands some shots on Usky. Tyson also lands a little shot when they leave the clinch. Usyk complains about being hit on the back of the head. Tyson jabs again, Usky is again waiting. Usky tries to throw a one two to Tysons body, both extremely light shots, the first catching Tyson on the arm and the second hitting Tyson in the stomach, but Tyson is moving away and it again has zero visible impact. Tyson then holds Usyk back briefly with his outstretch arm, Usyk tries to paw at Tysons stomach, but it's again with zero weight on the shot. Usky then lands two soft body shots on Tyson while he's against the ropes, and then his first impactful shot of the round, a left cross to Tysons face, but he can't follow it up, and Tyson just rolls out of it. Then Tyson throws a body shot, it's blocked by Usyk, and Tyson clinches him. They then get broken up by the referee, come together again, and Tyson lands a heavy body shot to Usyk, who tries to counter with a left hook, but Tyson just steps back and Usyk completely misses the target, hitting complete air. Both of them stand there for a second, before both throwing jabs at the same time and both connecting, and Tyson following up with a right hook, that Usyk just manages to catch with his glove, then they get into a clinch and Tyson is clearly bullying him around, and letting off shots as the clinch breaks up, with Usyk looking exhausted. Usyk goes for a jab, misses and gets counted by Tyson. Tyson then throws a two-punch combination, he lands them, but Usyk counters with a rolling right hook, probably his second only real decent shot of the round so far. Tyson backs off and starts circling Usyk, jabs him to the body, though it's not impactful. Throws two very light quick jabs, that Usyk blocks. Usyk throws back, but misses. Tyson then throws a couple feints, before going for a large body shot, taking a counter jab from Usyk in the process, but landing the body shot, and Usky recoils backwards, and then Tyson jabs him in the face. Tyson then throws another couple jabs to keep Usyk at distance, and then tries a combination of punches, which Usky manages to avoid. They clinch, Usyk throws a right hook and misses. Tyson throws another jab, and Usky tries to counter with a right jab, followed by a left cross, but misses both, the cross just going through air, as Tyson uses great defense and distance. Usky then chases Tyson and tries pawing at his face, but Tyson just backs out of it, before clinching. He also catches Usyk with another shot while in the clinch, though it's light. They break the clinch, then Usyk goes for a jab, catches Tyson lightly, who counters with a solid body shot. Usyk then tries to counter him with a left hook, and once again completely misses and hits just air, as Tyson moves backwards. Tyson dances around a bit, Usyk chases him down and throws two jabs, misses the first, lands the second, but Tyson is again just rolling out of it. Tyson then catches Usyk with another jab and clinches, hitting Usyk with a body shot and a shot to the face, while getting out of it. Then Usyk in the final seconds of the round, tries to throw a right, misses, then immediately throws a left cross, and hits Tyson, but also takes a solid shot to the face beforehand from Tyson. Probably his best shot of the round, but he also got hit by Tyson in the process and definitely not enough to win the round. This round was a masterclass by Tyson in my opinion. He easily controlled the round, while Usyk looked exhausted. He landed far more impactful shots, was the one that seemingly did the most damage, had the best defense, the better work-rate, showed great skill and footwork, and was just the far more effective of the two in this round. He made Usyk miss big at times and had him swinging at air, it was great footwork and defense by Tyson. So yeah, it wasn't a close round at all in my opinion, and I don't know what you watched. Tyson won that round comfortably, with Usyk just not doing enough at all, with most of his punches having barely any weight on them. He landed a couple decent shots, but it was no-where near enough. So yeah, I literally just watched it as I was typing this, and have gone through it punch by punch, so if you think I'm bias, we'll just have to agree to disagree. But I suggest you watch it again, and personally, I think you're the extremely bias one. You also seem to be extremely emotionally attached to the fight, to the point that literally all of your replies here are extremely toxic and clearly filled with extreme anger, so I'd suggest that you're probably the bias one in reality and projecting that onto others. If you're not able to be objective and discuss things in a calm and respectful manner, how can anyone take you seriously?
Instead of wasting myself all the time reading all of this, which i won't, as i already watch the fight like 5x. time already, and i know for certainty that Fury lost that Round quite clearly i won't argue with a biased Fury fanboy, which you are, and another alt account of some of his fanatics, i will just use this: Compubox highly inaccurate, but still: Total punches Fury - 12 Usyk - 13 Power shots: Fury - 6 Usyk - 9 AI/DeepStrike, the most accurate thing we have and the most unbiased thing as well: AI use 5 Criteria for scroing the rounds: Landed shots, Impactful Shots, Pressure, Aggression, Dominance(parts in the round where fighter dominates). All of this categories Usyk won them all. And won them wide as well. Stats on Round 11 alone: 8 landed Punches for Fury and just 1 impactful one 14 landed Punches for Usyk and 7 impactful ones But yeah you can dream about it as much as you like. Even the biggest Fury cheerleaders on here don't even think of giving the Round 11 to Fury. All of the UK commentators on Sky Sports score it for Usyk. Again Frank Warren which is beyond saving score it for Usyk. Garth A. Davies biggest Fury cheerleader had Usyk winning that round and the fight as well. Landed less, landing less power shots, being dominated around the ring, and put on the ropes, and Usyk ending the round with scrambling Fury eggs for breakfast with huge Left hand to the head, but punch of the round by far. But yeah it's a Fury round. I guess Round 8 was a Fury round as well, as Usyk just break his nose, nothing else. Round 9 was Fury as well, as he cross the ring in astonishing fashion and goes from one rope to the other, to the other, and to other ... And video proof: This content is protected You are trying to argue with the numbers from very beginning, cause you are biased, and you knows they are showing what we all saw, a clear cut victory for Usyk. And you can't have an argument for Fury, unless we remove the numbers completely, and then it comes fanboys bias and seeing something completely else than what actually happen.
It's a pointless debate if you're not even going to read or consider what others say. It becomes a non-discussion. Compubox isn't accurate, it's just two guys sat at ring side, pressing buttons on what they think landed. Same with the AI, which isn't actually intelligent, and is using an algorithm based of minimal criteria and isn't capable of actually comprehending what it's seeing. Although it's called 'artificial-intelligence', it isn't actually intelligent at all, and is just an elaborate algorithm, based on rigid and confined rules, just like all AI. Also your two sources contradict one another, which alone is telling to their accuracy, with Compubox stating that Tyson threw less in Round 11, yet Deepstrike has Tyson throwing more in 11. So which one is it? The AI also has Tyson listed as 0 on high impact shots in round 11, which is just laughable if you actually watch the round. Tyson lands numerous powerful body shots, one that literally has Usyk recoil, yet we're supposed to believe he landed 0 or almost 0 according to this AI? Also at the end of the Round, when Usyk lands a shot on Tyson, he's counter punched a split second before by a right hand from Tyson. So yeah.. zero high impact shots? hmm, no way. That alone makes the entire algorithm that the AI is based on extremely sketchy, if it's failing to recognize obvious shots that you can literally see for yourself. The AI also gives pressure to Usyk in Round 11, but as I've said before, the AI is unable to comprehend what pressure is effective and what isn't. Usyk was just not being effective in that round, and although Tyson was often moving backwards, he was staying within his own striking range, with him having the longer reach, and therefore it benefitted him to be in that position, and Usyk was unable to close Tyson down and apply effective pressure. He was constantly out of range of Tyson, and was not able to land many impactful shots that round. Again, he made Usyk hit air at times, and Tyson's skill, footwork and defense was very impressive that round. Also you claim bias again, but I'm not saying Tyson won the fight, I've said the opposite, Uysk won, but it was a close fight, and it's your scoring that's just ridiculous to anyone that actually watches and analyses the fight. You also list all these people, but your scores are widely inaccurate to all of them, and the judges at ringside, so if you're claiming their scorecards are correct now, and that they're all correct about Round 11, then you're basically admitting you're wrong yourself. But anyway, again, you're clearly an Usyk fan, and like I previously, you're unable to have a calm and reasonable discussion about it, and constantly say how you're not going to read others thoughts and opinions, use petty insults and clearly get angered and enraged by things you disagree with. Quite frankly, it's childish, and again, you're just far too emotionally attached to the result, for your opinion to be taken seriously.
Bro you can quote me till the ends of the day, you won't make me read your wall of text, didn't you get it by now ? From the first post you have done, which i forced myself to gave you a chance as a user you stated a bunch of nonsenses about the AI, without even knowing how it's work, just to justify your clear bias towards Fury. Then you claim that was a close fight, that could have gone either way, and there you lost me forever. You had to be mental to make a case for Fury even losing by 1 point, let alone winning. You can make a tirade of wall text, won't matter, won't read it. You somehow see stuffs that aren't there. And when it's comes to Usyk and his work, you are going completely blind. You ain't fooling anyone that you aren't an alt account and a Fury fanboy. There isn't even a slight argument for scoring the fight for Fury, as well as scoring one of the clean rounds for Usyk to be Fury's one, aka the 11. I had no problem with your opinion, as the end of the day it's your. You can be deluded as much as you like, but don't try to force your view and nonsenses to me, it's not going to work. I'm not blind, don't have eye problems, and at worst can look at other videos and what people have saw + there is the AI stats, that you can cry as much as you like, they are a fact, your opinion is it not. 9-3 for Usyk, move along.
I didn't score the fight for Tyson, I scored it for Usyk. Usyk won 114-113 in my opinion. Also it's not nonsense about the AI, but I can only assume you're unable to comprehend what I'm saying about it, plus you haven't read it apparently, so there's that. You also keep assuming I haven't read about Deepstrike, but I have, both looking at the website, and also on reddit, reading the creators own posts no less, and my points still stand. If you understand what subjectivity is and how scoring boxing is largely a subjective exercise and how a computer program is unable to see and comprehend things in the way that a human mind can, with humans being able to use things like critical thinking for instance, then you'd understand why an AI is incapable of scoring a boxing fight accurately, at least in its current state, since boxing is a very unique sport, with lots of elements open to interpretation, even just the effectiveness of a fighters punches for example. I'm not saying the tech isn't impressive in some ways, of course it is, but it's limited and open to huge flaws. As for not replying to your posts, or quoting you, sadly for you this is a public forum, and just as much as you're allowed to reply and quote others, I am too, whether you read it or not, matters little, I'm still going to reply and state what I have to say. I also have no problem with your opinion either, other than I disagree with it. You're welcome to believe whatever you want as well, even if you believe Usyk won every round, that's fine, but if you're going to post that in a public forum, then you have to expect others to reply to you, and give their own thoughts and opinions as well, on what you've said, and if you're not going to read that, and just resort to childish insults and things, and accuse people of alting and trying to force their opinions onto you, and whatever else, I do find that pretty stupid and immature, but that's also up to you, if you want to behave that way, then it is what it is, but like I've said in my last two replies to you, how you expect people to take you seriously, i don't know. It just makes you seem deranged and it becomes a pointless exercise to debate with you, and you're just wasting your own time, more than anyone else's.
You are trying a bit too hard, for new user, don't you think? The first very thing you do when registered in a new forum, as a new user, you are quoting 1 person and chasing him around, trying to convince yourself as i totally don't read your post, that Fury won X or Y rounds, and how a system that you have no clue how it's work it's inaccurate. Yeah you 100% are not one of the Fury fanatics, that is now on new alt account, as he is scared to come with his real account. Curious as there is plenty of Fury main accounts that have gone missing, since Usyk school Fury. Or maybe you are Fury himself, and trying to convince yourself that you won the fight, who knows? Still you can quote me with a wall of text 50 more time i still won't read it, and my reply to you will be - Happy New Year !!!
I didn't know shadow had a twin.. Also AI is going to be the best way to judge boxing, BECAUSE it is so subjective. AI's will be better at objectively judging fights in 99,99% of all cases, because of having access to more and better information. Recognizing patterns is actually THE thing machine learning is good at, it's interpreting data that's already there. So the critique of AI scoring in this thread is pretty baseless from some users.
