Go and read the title of the thread you simpleton. Onto ignore you go. Life is too short to deal with cretins like you.
I never said he hasn't but that doesn't mean he deserves to be in the top 10 like some people are claiming. He simply hasn't got the resume to be rated as such i'm not saying it's his fault but that's just how it is, possibly if Usyk can beat a few more contenders he would have a strong argument for top 10 but as of right now definitely not. Also you can't compare Heavyweights from that era because most of them wouldn't even be classed as Heavyweights in modern era. If you're comparing Fury against the best Heavyweights who range from between 215 pounds and above then i'm not sure how highly he rates TBH. I mean Fury has shown he is very beatable against fighters like Wallin, Cunningham, who aren't even top 10 Heavyweights, and an MMA fighter arguably beat him recently. I certainly wouldn't put Fury in the same class as Holmes, Ali, Lewis, etc on a H2H basis.
How ? in a P4P sense i can understand but regarding all time Heavyweight rankings ? i don't see how TBH.
Why are people just talking about Fury and Joshua in terms of Usyks legacy here.. many of the great historical HWs were essentially CWs or smaller by today's standards.. so u can combine both his HW & CW achievements here and stack the entirety of his body of work up against those past greats .. 22-0, all the marbles, still going strong at 37.. ye , he'd stack up with them all. Perfect career.
He has better skills then both Marciano and Dempsey, and a better wins than Tyson & Dempsey. Marciano with his wins over Charles x2, Walcott x2 & Moore still has more and better wins, but h2h Marciano ain't touching Usyk. *edit* However if you take into account what the poster above me just said CW being bigger men then Marciano fought and add Glowacki, Huck, Briedis, Hunter, Gassiev too AJx2 & Fury that evens the field more there as well.
I am just going to put this out there, and ya'all can do as you like with it, because I don't exactly have a dog on the fight. If you are a purist and want to say that half of Usyk's legacy is at cruiser, and he's a pound for pound great instead of a heavyweight great, I don't mind, just as long as you acknowledge that he is great on some level. But really, what's the difference? He's a great heavyweight, or a great fighter at heavyweight. A) He's 6'3" and 221-223, same height and reach as Ali, and a heavier fighting weight. About the same as "Big" George Foreman. B) He has beaten two of the most capable super heavies in history in three rights. 3) His "crusierweight" opponents have a 200 pound limit and rehydration clauses, and walk in on fight night as massive heavies in most eras. 4) A number of the cruisers he has beaten have fought credibility at heavy, including Briedis. Bellew, Huck, and Hunter. 5) There is a long tradition of good champions and challengers coming from cruiser or lower, so why are they not good fights anyway, if he was beating champs? Did Fitzsimmons, Tunney, Charles, Walcott, Patterson, Spinks, Holy, Moorer, Byrd, Haye, and probably a few others I am forgetting not start below heavy? Did Marciano, Demspey and Patterson not fight their whole careers below 200? Did Louis, Baer, Schmeling, and even Liston not start below 200? Did Larry Holmes, one of the guys held up as a head-to-head top five by most people in here, not lose to a LHW in Spinks? Was one of Joe Louis' best defenses not Billy Conn? What is the justification for saying that Usyk's cruiser fights don't count towards his heavyweight ranking? I say the guy is a great heavy and a great pound for pound. But again, I'm not mad about it.
How much succes did Usyk’s CW openents have at Heavyweight? If you want to rate them as Heavyweights.
Lol the fact that you have Marciano as a ATG heavyweight pretty much shows nobody can take you serious. Then you add Usyk and you just become laughing stock.
I would say Tyson stopping Holmes and Spinks especially in manner in which Tyson did it is equally impressive, considering Spinks and Holmes are considered ATGs and had over 100 fights and 30+ championship fights between them and were never stopped in their entire career other than by Tyson. Yes Holmes was older but when you take into account Holmes continued his career into 90s and schooled Mercer and run a prime Holyfield close it makes Tyson's stoppage look even better. Usyk's wins over Fury and Joshua are very impressive based on the size difference, but I wouldn't consider either fighter great and Fury recently looked terrible against an MMA fighter. And no I don't consider Usyk's Cruiserweight resume to be a part of his Heavyweight resume, another poster made a good point that maybe you could make an exception if they moved up and had success at Heavyweight. But to me that's kind of a flawed logic because you could do that with any weightclass I'm not believer of that theory honestly. I can see an argument that you could have Usyk in your top 10 if you're strictly talking about H2H ability but resume wise ? I don't see it personally. But that's just my opinion if you see it differently that's fine we'll agree to disagree. I'm more inclined to say that Usyk is rated highly P4P but not so much in Heavyweight rankings, hes more like a top 20 Heavyweight for me rather than top 10.
Lol I will say this again. Usyk fanboys have reach Rocky Marciano fanboys level of silly. Usyk the blown up cruiser weight because overrated mentally damaged Joshua after Ruiz beat him first and then beat overrated media made junky Fury. Now his biased fanbase act like he can't lose. Rocky Marciano was a 180 pound fighter who fought 180 pound mafia controlled fighter, tomato cans and old men and now he is a ATG heavyweight great even though by modern standards he would be a light heavyweight.
Lol um how about no. Usyk is skilled? You mean because he could slap his way against no talent guys like Joshua and still only land 25 percent and less of his punches? Usyk isnt skilled and he couldn't beat most heavyweight champions. He could probably beat 170 guys like Gene Tunney
Lol nobody cares about the cruiser weight division. What does being a cruiser weight champion have to do with what Usyk did as a heavyweight? Usyk has done nothing special at heavyweight so how is a heavyweight ATG?
Lol 3 good wins at heavyweight? Dubois isn't that good. Joshua isn't that good. and Tyson Fury isn't that good. So Usyk has no good wins at heavyweight.
