NoNeck as I've always said you have good knowledge on the sport and I respect your opinion on alot of subjects. But let's be real you have some type of bee in your bonnet when it comes to Foreman. I don't think I've ever seen you pick Foreman in a single hypothetical match up. Recently you was trying to make a case for Maskaev against Foreman for crying out loud who has a below average chin and been stopped numerous times by fringe contenders. I do think Foreman does get a tad overrated at times but he would jab Joyce's head off and tee off on him at will. I think Foreman struggles more vs the likes of Zhang, Usyk, than the likes of Joyce. You're saying Joyce is past his prime but he did exactly what he always does vs Chisora and that's come forward with no defense relying on his size and workrate. It was still apparent Joyce's stamina was still in good nick it's just Chisora hits deceptively hard and Joyce is and has always been way too hittable.
If you read it really carefully, I didn’t actually pick Maskaev to win. Regarding Joyce, Foreman had a physical style and wasn’t mowing down giants. Joyce mowed down Parker and destroyed Dubois with a jabs, regardless of how quickly he fell off after. This one isn’t Foreman’s match up. Foreman wasn’t even Parker’s size and had none of his durability
I never said you did I said you were making a strong case for Maskaev. Joyce walked Parker down because Parker is not a big puncher. Parker may be a fairly big guy but he does have stand out power. Has Parker ever stopped a top 10 ranked opponent ? What's his best stoppage ? That's what you need to ask yourself. Parker is boxer with mediocre power so Joyce matched up well against him with his style. Against more concussive hitters Joyce will be less effective because he has virtually no defense. And despite Joyce having a good chin his chin can be gotten to as Zhang showed and even a totally shot Chisora showed. Dubois was a bit green vs Joyce I feel and I think hes improved a bit as a fighter and seems to miraculously be showing more heart in fights. Dubois was not battle tested vs Joyce and gave up at the first sign of adversity.
Not only does Parker lack power, it's a matter of styles too. Parker willingly backs up or uses his legs and is more of an outside fighter on the back foot than a come forward aggressive type (although he did make adjustments in the Wilder match). Joyce walking Parker down is hardly convincing evidence he could walk Foreman down...unless you're convinced Foreman just sucks and loses almost every h2h matchup like NoNeck. Yes, Dubois was still pretty young and inexperienced against Joyce. Actually, both guys were very green so there's not a lot to gather from that either. Dubois is much more competent, stronger, and a better boxer now with more mental strength as well after the Hrgovic and Miller fights. Id be much more impressed if Joyce beat the current version of Dubois. Right now, Joyce has similar overall ability and accomplishments to guys like James Bonecrusher Smith/Buddie Baer/Mac Foster/Dillian Whyte etc. Big guys with decent power, durability, and mediocre skills who can be slightly dangerous, but not too much trouble and have bad defense. You've got at least 1-2 in every era. Joyce's biggest issue is that he is unbelievably slow, almost 100% slow twitch muscle. If he at least had better defense and had a game plan other than just lumbering forward throwing arm punches, he'd be a greater threat.
Foreman would have to box Joyce to win. If he tried his usual slugger tactics I think he might well blow his wad and get ground to bits late.
It is interesting. Are we really saying that George wouldn't stop Joyce as comprehensively as Zhang? George was much more offensive, fought at a much higher pace and for me, hits as hard as Zhang. Yes, his punches aren't as sneaky, as disguised, but big Joe would have to eat more hard punches than he did against Zhang and you can argue that Zhang 1 was peak Joe. I was on the Joyce train! Happy to admit that. I still am to an extent. Love the guy. I might even have picked him at some point, but although young George is smaller, I think he is equally strong, and the fact he doesn't fight for points wins augers badly for Joyce. It wouldn't be a blowout, but George would get to Joe from moment one of the fight, and he'd administer an uncultured, methodical beating. Joyce doesn't hit hard enough to deter Foreman, although he is heavy-handed. This is a fight too far for Joyce.