Is George Foreman a top 10 heavyweight of all-time ?

He had the advantage of being the bigger stronger man in the vast majority of his fights and never was the smaller man when facing someone in the top 10. I'd say thats a pretty big advantage relative to most greats and something he wouldn't enjoy in other eras.

If he'd been the size of say Patterson or Quarry I doubt he would have gotten as far as he did

 

Usyk at no. 2 and no Holmes. Different and interesting.

 

1) Muhammad Ali
2) Lennox Lewis
3) Larry Holmes
4) Joe Louis
5) Sonny liston
6) Mike Tyson
7) George Foreman
8) Joe Frazier
9) Vitali Klitschko
10) Evander Holyfield

 

Hes the same size as Usyk who apparently isn't a real HW.

 

Seems you’re not going to touch that Liston comparison with a ten foot pole. Smart.

 

Probably doesn't make NoNeck's top 50. Lol

 

He’s for sure the son of a beaten Foreman opponent. Has to be.

 

You betting on Kirkman or O' Halloran?

 

Ya.

Though given the nature of his two careers, personal emphasis may make the ranking vary. Had he not retired at the ripe age of twenty eight, he could have possibly go on and enter a proper prime. Making for a more interesting life story, but less consistent career was the ten years layoff and the larger than life comeback.

A-tier wins.

Frazier from the Sunshine Showdown. Sure, Frazier split his camp between partying and training, and he was fading post '71, but Foreman exemplified how a deserving contender ought to send the no longer worthy champion away. In an utter two rounds demolition. Worth noting Foreman was a solid underdog, with some major bookies outright refusing to make odds on the fight if I remember correctly. Their second bout in Nassau Coliseum was against a nearly retired Joe, but once against the reinvented Foreman proved he is all wrong for Frazier.

Ken Norton. Another famous two round demolition right after Kenny beat the Greatest himself, and dropped a split decision against possibly the best looking post-exile Ali. A pure quality win that cemented Foreman as a titanic figure in the division at the tender age of 24.

Ron Lyle. New trainer. New attempted style. Coming off of a shattering lost to Ali and only having the whimsical versus Five exhibition to shake off rust and shame before entering the ring with the granite chinned, dynamite puncher in Ron Lyle right after he prevailed in trenches against Earnie Shavers. Sure, defensive wizards and elite boxers could outpoint Ron, but he was a terrible news for a fighter of George's style, especially in what was especially a comeback bout.

Micheal Moorer. Don't stand in front of him Micheal. He wants you to stand in front of him. Alas. The iconic win of George's second career with WBA, IBF, and lineal titles on the line. Foreman's age alone makes a win against Moorer impressive, but generally with his wins against Stewart, Schulz, Cooper, Jirov, Botha, and a faded Holyfield, I rate Michael somewhat higher than most.

B-tier wins.

George Chuvalo. The quintessential gatekeeper. Tough, gritty, and hard hitting. Young Foreman pretty much controlled the fight with a jab, resembling his golden medal bout against Ionas Chepulis.

Gregorio Peralta. Two wins (one being a rare stoppage) against Argentina's own defensive wizard in Peralta. The stoppage was what the likes of Bonavena and Lyle could not add to their collection.

Axel Schulz and Alex Stewart. Incredibly tough fights highlighting that George is not retaining the quality of performance from period leading up to the Holyfield fight. Solid wins nonetheless (and if one scored it for Schulz, then Briggs robbery evens it out resume-wise I reckon.)

.. and a list of the likes of Bert Cooper, Scott LeDoux, Jose Roman, Dino Denis, Boone Kirkman, Lou Savarese, Crawford Grimsley, or a ghost of Cooney.

Generally speaking though, a lot of Foreman's greatness lies in the manner in which he overcame some of his opponents (Lyle and Moorer when he was put against the odds, or Norton and Frazier, when he had something to prove), the improbability of his comeback, and just how iconic some of his wins were, on top of a quality, if lacking in numerous names. Whenever I see how the variance in his rankings, I completely understand. He is top ten though. No doubt.

 

Curveball - Roman.

 

Excellent post.

 

Agreed.

 

I can't imagine NoNeck being that tan, lol.

 

LOL at Vitali

 

You left out Wepner which gives Foreman his 6th win over an Ali title opponent. Foreman stopped all 6 by round 5. Ali was 7-2 against the group with 3 stops.

The reason I have Foreman as the HW GOAT is he checks the most of the most boxes except the number of title fights/defenses which hes got enough of 5/7. Foreman has about 20 title caliber wins, 14 HW title contenders not counting Briggs and several LHW contenders.

Most important hes arguably the most powerful and most durable champ. Foreman had a 93% KO rate as of the Moorer fight and the Ali loss was the only time he was KO'd. This is higher than any 20th century HW champ except Bruno. Foreman remained unknockdownable until his late 40s something that seperates him from my number 2 Joe Louis. And say what you want about his opponents after Schulz they could hit hard. That is the best combination of power and durability the sports ever seen.

And of course theres H2H. Foreman was champ in both the 2 best HW eras and the 70s are considered the best era namely because of him. If not for Foremans 2nd career the 90s would be considered the gold standard today. As I've said on numerous occasions while Foreman only fought 2 of the best HWs of the 90s(him, Lewis, Bowe, Moorer, Holyfield,Tyson)the only HW from that period to fight more than that was Holyfield and Holyfield had a losing record. Even without this Foreman had a case to be the top dog H2H in the 70s because while Ali upset him he easily beat Frazier and Norton who almost won trilogys with Ali.

I don't know how Lyle was terrible news for Foreman when he was out by Round 5. If anything power hitters couldn't win because George had a better combination of power and durability than virtually anyone whose ever fought and Lyle tested that. The list of HWs who could have done better in such a situation is very slim(Liston, Wlad, Dempsey maybe). Foremans weakness were super durable point fighters like Ali and Jimmy Young who might be the 2 best HW point fighters of the 20th century. Staying upright and winning rounds is how you beat Foreman not getting into a brawl with him.

Note-When I say contender I mean someone who fought for a world title.