Joshua vs Ortiz in 2018

Ortiz came very very close to beating Wilder, twice.

He'd have success against AJ but my line of thought is he'd have much less success than he had against wilder and he'd get beaten down and stopped.

 

Let me remind folks that the BEST version of Andy Ruiz barely survived a 42 year old Luis Ortiz in a slug fest after Ortiz had been stopped by Wilder twice.

A less experienced version of that Andy Ruiz beat up and STOPPED prime Joshua. How is it inconceivable for some of these fanboys that a younger, better, undefeated Ortiz has massive success against a guy not known for his chin, will, defense, boxing skills?

They are blinded by fan loyalty.

 

I think Joshua would’ve KO’d him within 5 rounds, and then everyone would’ve said “Ortiz was untested, he’s ancient, he’s on heart meds, was never that good, was a hype job - AJ cherry picked him cos he’s a bum”

Spmething along those lines?

 

This is the same Joshua that got blown out by Andy Ruiz.

Charles Martin is the ONLY top 10 (surely he was at the bottom of it?) fighter Joshua has stopped inside 6 rounds.

Strong prediction though.

 

Ortiz is a solid win, and Wilder's best, but the fact that Wilder's best win would make AJ's top 4 or 5 (behind Povetkin, Klit, Ruiz, Parker imo) kind of speaks to his shallow résumé. I don't think another of Wilder's top 5 wins would make AJ's top 5.

 

Saying that out of shape Andy Ruiz coming off a 16 month lay off who in his previous fight was knocked down by Arreola is his best version is laughable.

He also stopped Wallin in 5.

 

Stopping an undefeated Ortiz in 2018 would easily be in Joshua's top 3 wins, and stopping one loss Ortiz with a single shot would be right behind it. 2018 Ortiz is clearly a better fighter than the 283 pound blob of Andy Ruiz that Joshua "outboxed"

 

A layoff does hurt, you're right (unless we're talking about a 41 year old Klitschko's 2 year layoff, right? He was better than ever, right?). That said, Andy looked in great shape. Him getting knocked down by Arreola speaks to his level and not any condition he was in. Andy was always just a top 10 guy who could be outboxed or dropped by anyone in the top 20 on a given night. He happened to hit the lotto getting swapped in against a fragile champ.

Joshua stopped Wallin, did he? Bonafide top 10 operator, OTTO. MF. WALLIN, yeah? May we all remember the name: OTTO WALLIN. The guy who definitely wasn't bumped up to rank 10 in the ring because Joshua needed a featherfist name for his rebuild. Definitely not! He was a real deal top 10! Him getting wrecked by a 50 year old Chisora and having no wins above rank 25 is irrelevant. Charles Martin and OTTO WALLIN were obliterated by Joshua's power punches inside the first half of a fight! Let it be known.

 

Klitschko didn't have a 2 year layoff. He had a similar layoff to Ruiz - 15 months. But Wlad was always in training during that stretch - Fury ducked him twice and then he was in training for the AJ fight. Andy on the other hand was smoking weed, drinking Coronas and eating Snickers and hot dogs. He wasn't as dedicated as he was in his prime 2016-2019. So saying he was at his peak form is just ridiculous.

Well, you were the one including Charles Martin, so if we are talking Top 10 wins with a stoppage in 6, you need to add Wallin there. Nobody claims it was a sensational win or anything. On the other hand, win over Martin was actually impressive looking retrospectively seeing how AJ easily dismantled him. Nobody did him in that way.

 

So the layoff didn't affect Klitschko because he was training? He somehow became (the first athlete ever, by the way) BETTER by turning 40, then 41, without fighting? You're hoping folks believe that while at the same time believing that an Andy Ruiz in his early 30's getting in arguably the best shape of his career is WORSE. I understand now.

Speaking of impressive wins and dismantling fighters, who is Charles Martin's most impressive win? Knee injury Glazkov? Not surprised you were impressed as Joshua's biggest fan, but you're really hyping the wrong win here.

 

You say 'easily' top 3 but only made a case for how Ortiz is better than overweight Ruiz (still debatable, given Ruiz's pop and Ortiz's shakey whiskers). Povetkin, Parker, even a Whyte coming into his prime, would've been very tough fights for Ortiz.

Even then, my point is that Ortiz is literally the only name on Wilder's resumé who makes a case to be in AJ's top 5, even 8 or so (Pulev, Martin, Takam all could beat 'prime' Stiverne, IMO). Wilder's résumé is dreadful.

 

Nobody said Wlad was at his peak at 41, lol.

Martin was an ok win for AJ, not his Top 5 probably, but Martin was a good, durable fighter and would be a Top 3 win for Wilder probably.

 

Ortiz 60-40 favourite.

 

I didn't say people said he was at his peak. I said people have claimed he was better at 41 than 39, despite not being active during that time. Joshua fans such as yourself consistently claim that the 41 year old version is better. You've also claimed that Ruiz is much worse for being inactive, despite showing up in the best shape of his career. So which is it?

You may be alone in the claim of Martin being a "good, durable fighter". What is his best win?

 

He might have been. He was fired up to get the belt back and we all know in what situation he was in late 2015 with motivation and family issues. The thing is he was still as formidable in early 2017 as he was in late 2015. I never said he was better.

Depends what you mean by "best shape". If you're talking best weight during his stance in Top 10, it would be Arreola. If you mean "the freshest" it would be his Parker bout. If you mean dedication and constant training it would be his AJ I fight. Definitely not Ortiz.

Gerald Washington probably, which would hang around Top 5 Wilder's win. He's not a world beater at any stretch, but he went to distance with Kownacki and Anderson and he had Ortiz down 2 times in their fight.