Why does Tyson get a pass?

Go ahead and disrespect Angelo Dundee by claiming he was training a junkie (without proof or even anecdotes).

 

If you want to call Thomas a liar, go ahead. He himself said he was on heroin and God knows how many other drugs.

As for whether he was using during the Tyson fight, that's anyone's guess. The way Thomas describes his bad habits, if anything, you'd need to prove he was 100% clean.

 

Yeah, I read him say that he went on heroin after Tyson beat him up and before he started boxing.

 

There's a reason Thomas had his last good win in '85 and his best performance in '84. For reference, Tyson was coming off a 1 round KO over a ranked contender going into the Douglas fight, and would follow up with two first round KO's after that, would stop contenders for another 10+ years actually.

 

Do people not realize how many contenders/champs in the past were alchies and drug addicts?

 

FFS Louis did heroine and Jack Dempsey liked coke didn't he? lol.

 

Louis liked booger sugar, too, but I think that came later. Yes, drugs were pervasive. And champs or name boxers had access and a lot of down time.

 

If from the start, from the very first year in the gym you know a lot of boxers wind up mentally "scarred" you'd enjoy the high life too while you had it. Monzon did it right, party hard, enjoy your health it won't last after boxing most of the time... but stay in decent shape and take your camps / fights seriously, these guys deserve to be "party boys" while they can.

 

Not Lewis’ problem really. He could only get in there and win the fight.

Though some could reason that Lewis was under par himself in the first fight, if we’re running with the no excuses line, same applies to McCall.

So, all excuses removed, Lewis lost to Ollie and then avenged that loss.

 

Thomas was head over heels in the throes of being a drug addict again when he fought Tyson. In retrospect the HBO preview where he denies being back on drugs before the fight in an interview while having the most back on drugs like mannerisms and face is very regrettable.Thomas aged dramatically during the Berbick fight and was never the same again. In essence Tyson beat a version of Thomas addicted to drugs who still put up a very worthy fight. Thomas was class as a man and fought and conquered his addictions and became a wonderful teacher and mentor.A focused and drug free Thomas active in the mid and late 80s would have been a formidable prospect to fight for anyone.

 

Its unclear who is a better boxer H2H same with Douglas v Tucker but I would pick Douglas to beat the rest of the list you provided. Tyson is probably a better boxer P4P but he really needed to come out of the gate strong.

10 round decisions against inferior but very good fighters are hard to win consistantly. Many a great has many 10 round losses to the Jesse Fergusons of their time. Especially when a fighter is a prospect which Douglas still was.

 

Tyson clearly began slipping when he fired Rooney. Buster fought an awesome fight but it was a combination of factors that led to Mike's ko loss. I can't see how objective observers can claim the Tyson who showed up for Douglas was the same fine tuned, motivated fighting machine of 1986-1988.

 

Let’s apply that standard fairly then: which if Tyson’s opponents were absolutely peak, nothing going on that might make them less than 100%?

Tony Tucker, broken hand.

Michael Spinks, creaky knees/no legs.

Larry Holmes, long layoff/short camp/no tuneup.

Tony Tubbs, fat/not in good shape.

Pinklon Thomas, using heroin.

Tyrell Biggs, drug issues.

I can keep going.

But Mike gets the pass here and these guys don’t. That’s the heart of the thread.

IMO, the only difference between Tyson of Buster and Tyson of Truth Williams is that Mike got his ass kicked. That’s it. He got physically dominated in his absolute prime. Just doesn’t happen to most greats … but by all means, let’s hand Asterisk Mike another pass.

 

That's just your opinion. Thomas said otherwise.

 

The irony of your post is that Spinks and Biggs were undefeated and the others had basically only lost against champions other than Ruddock having an asthma attack against Jaco.