Could Sonny Liston have made it undefeated vs Louis title defenses?

And so ......look what Sonny Liston did to Chuck Wepner.Again Wepner was no ATG but he was better than McBride.
Oh wait.....Liston actually defeated Wepner while Tyson lost to McBride.

 

Not a lie but a genuine mistake,which I acknowledged in another post.By all means celebrate this.It's
the only inaccuracy from me.Wish I could say the same for you.

 

Nope,you still dodging my request for proof that Martin injured his eye before his fight with Liston.

 

Good points mate.

 

The brave men you describe as ' bums ' or ' human punch bags ' deserve more than your contempt.As somebody who claims to have knowlege of boxing you should know this.

LOL ! You go on about Jack Dempsey's lack of amateur experience but he already had 37 professional fights by the time he lost to Meehan.
In fact Dempsey's record against the 5' 9'' Meehan was embarrassing. 5 fights-2 victories,1 defeat and 2 draws.
Apparently the 5' 9'' Meehan was chubby at around 190 lbs.So much for you mocking Martin when Leotis was fighting fit at 199lbs.


Ok,now let me say that I have the utmost respect for Ezzard Charles,and his suffering from Lou Gehrigs disease was genuinely tragic.Also pound-for-pound Ezzard is probably among the
top 3 or 4 fighters in history.But as a heavyweight I would have to back Sonny against Ezzard.
It's a real stretch to say that all of Charles's late career defeats were due to his
sickness.Perhaps Charles was becoming to suffer from the onset of Lou Gehrig's disease at the tail-end of his career but it is highly unlikely this disease had any bearing on his earlier defeats.

Yes absolutely,it is tragic that this great man's life was ruined and shortened by that horrible disease.

 

Bonavena was outboxed by ancient Patterson and by slugger Ron Lyl, hardly good fighter.

Jimmy Ellis defeat of Patterson are questionable, it should be a draw, and that was the weakest era he foight in.

 

If they deserved more than being bums, they wil achieve something, not stay bums for the rest of their lifes.

Dempsey didn't have amateur record at all and still he won by KO in the rematch, Liston had amateur record and god knows hoe many fights facing Martin and still lost against Martin.

Leotis was anything but 199 pounds, his real weight 175-185, he just bulked up.

You disn't say anything about earlier defeats, you mentioned ones when he was way past his prime..
He developed that in 1955 when everything starting to fade, even Charles said somethinf was wrong.

Charles had good amateur record and 122 pro fights, yes he lose or win some, but as a LHW he defeated Joe Louis and Walcott and as LHW he defeated Moore, he was good HW and the GOAT LHW, Charles re ord is way greater than Liston's and Martin's together.

 

Wepner was not any better than McBride, perhpas he's much worse losing against so many guys by TKO or Ko.

And McBride was much bigger man than even wepner.

 

Why then you didn't admit that yourself at first but you continued saying Sonny is older?

 

I did, you can find it yourself, it was the Wendell Newton fight, recently I posted it here.

 

Oh really ? Ok,I'll have a look.I do hope it's firm medical evidence to back up your claim !

 

Perhaps you can have a look at the interval between my erroneous post and Cross Trainer pointing out my
mistake.Hardly a prolonged campaign of fibbing is it ?

 

W

Wepner was practically the same height as McBride.Regardless of difference in weight
it's blatantly obvious that Liston ( a middle-aged Liston ) would have brutalised McBride the
same way he did to Wepner.

 

Your attitude,quite frankly,towards the men brave enough to enter the ring says more about you than those warriors.

Your argument concerning Dempsey is bizarre to say the least.He had 37 fights (as I have already pointed out ) before facing Meehan..Do you honestly think Dempsey gained no fighting experience before turning professional ?
Seriously ? So what if Leotis Martin bulked up to 199 lbs.He was still far more formidable than than the fat,5' 9'' roly-poly Meehan.

You are preaching to the converted as far as Ezzard Charles is concerned.I have always been a huge fan of Ezzard Charles and I fully acknowledge his greatness.
Did you miss the bit when I said that on a pound-for-pound basis Charles is probably one of the 3 or 4 greatest fighters in history ?
Yes he did defeat the great Joe Louis but Louis was way past prime.A peak Sonny Liston would have destroyed that version of Louis.
Ok,if Ezzard felt he already had symptons of that awful disease as early as 1955 we'll leave it at that.Ezzard,as being a great fighter,was by all accounts a very honourable man.He wouldn't lie about such matters.
However I know this is very inconvenient for you but how about Ali losing to Splnks,Dempsey losing to Meehan,Tyson losing to McBride,and Holyfield losing to Moorer ?
Now Michael Moorer really was a light-heavyweight !

 

Weren’t the Meehan fights like 4 rounders?