How much is Bowe's win over Holyfield worth in historical terms?

Is how an athlete performs against other athletes and what stages of their careers they were in not important?

 

Of course, and you must always pay attention to that. That's what matters, as well as how these fights unfolded. Therefore, such dry, contextless comments are pure ignorance. 1-4, 2-3, 5-1, etc. Leon Spinks beating Ali was one thing, Joe Frazier beating Ali was another. Do Usyk or the Klitschko brothers have any IBHOF inductees under their belt? No. Oliver McCall has, Rahman has, Douglas has, Moorer, Sanders has, Brewster has, and in each case, these were victories over fighters in their prime. If Jimmy Young were more liked by the judges, he would have a 3-0 record over IBHOF inductees. Vitali has none. Wlad has none. Seriously, when someone starts a thread with such a statistic, I already know they're a new fan who just heard about the IBHOF and treats it as some kind of honor. Was Sonny Liston, who was 0-0 with the IBHOF in 1960, easier to beat than Liston, who was 2-0 in 1964? If Patterson had beaten Liston, he would still be 1-0, even though Liston in 1962 was a much bigger success than Moore in 1955. I don't know if you understand what I'm talking about, but never forget the context. Otherwise, you'll think Kevin McBride has a better IBHOF record than Mike Tyson, and because he beat him in a head-to-head fight, you'll rank him higher in the heavyweight boxing rankings. That's a road to nowhere, my friend.

 

I was going to let others fill in the blanks. Beating a former light heavyweight who moved up in ranks to beat a past prime champion and beating a former champion who was 39 years old and retired for nearly two years doesn't impress me. Neither does Leon Spinks and Hector Camacho beating the ghosts of Muhammad Ali and Sugar Ray Leonard. That is why it is important to state where the athletes were in their careers when the competition took place. As to being a new fan my maternal grandfather was an amateur boxer and my maternal granduncle was a professional boxer who shared a common opponent with Jake LaMotta. I remember them taking me to Golden Gloves competition at the Garden when I was ten years old.

 

I apologize if I offended you. Your statistical quotes without context convinced me you're completely clueless, but I understand it was a provocation.

As for Spinks/Holmes vs. Tyson, I understand that the course of those fights has some significance. Spinks was 32 years old, had five heavyweight title fights, including breaking Larry Holmes's long-standing dominance, something none of the 46 heavyweights Holmes defeated did. In this context, mentioning Spinks was a former LHW is a .m strange I'll never understand why people have a problem with Tyson defeating the lineal heavyweight champion in half round because he was also a LHW four years earlier, but they have no problem with the fact that the great Holmes couldn't do anything for 30 rounds.
Holmes was Usyk's age in 1988, and he turned out to be a very long-lived boxer. For 30 years, no one was able to finish Holmes, not before 1988 (Shavers, Cooney, Norton) nor long after 1988 (Holyfield, Mercer, McCall). And yet, knocking out Larry doesn't impress you... excuse me, after watching the Golden Gloves tournament with your grandfather, have you seen any other important fights?

 

Buster's win over Tyson is greater than Bowe's versus Holyfield IMO.

Evan on the night, admittedly was better than the Tyson that Buster beat, but historically, considering the odds and what the victory meant in the context of where each fighter was at the time of their career and projected career path, Buster's win is one of the greatest feats achieved in any division.

 

Buster was +4200., but here's the thing. A lot of houses wouldn't even take odds

• Bookmakers wanted balanced bets: Sportsbooks try to set odds so that they get roughly equal money bet on both sides, minimizing their risk. However, with Tyson, almost everyone was betting on him to win. The head bookmaker at the Mirage casino, Jimmy Vaccaro, kept raising the odds on Douglas (from 27:1 to 42:1) because bets kept pouring in on Tyson. He even received a $168,000 bet on Tyson that would have only won $4,000.
  

 

It is, but Rahmans best win is also better than Lewis's best win...

I think Bowe is great, I can't think of another fight id rather see than Bowe/Lewis, and I really don't know for sure who wins.

But the resume is so thin, there's lots of questions for me.(maybe he just had Holys number?) I never know if he's overated or underated.

 

I disagree. Bowe was favored going in. Holyfield was still a questionable blown up cruiserweight who was forced to go the distance by two forty plus year old ex-heavyweight champs and almost upset by Bert Cooper in-between. It was a great fight for sure. It was Bowe's career defining win, yes. However, I will say that the fight was more about Holyfield proving his legitimacy as a champion by going give and take in a terrific battle against a young giant. As far as Bowe, I have always enjoyed him , rooted for him and feel for him today as a punchy , broke wreck but I simply don't feel a decision win over an older , much smaller man with a stylistic match up that is not the most challenging to your own skills and style to be a two generation greater division win. As far as most impressive win, Lewis blowing out Razor Ruddock who just went two very tough bouts with Tyson or his destroying the same Golata that wrecked Bowe were far more impressive. I view impressive wins when someone is challenged in their potential weak spots more than their strengths ... Bowe never fought a big, highly talented puncher and it was because his chin was always in question . The man was flattened several times in the amateurs and got hit too much .. As far as the biggest wins of the past forty years or so at heavyweight I think Buster stopping Tyson and Holyfield upsetting Tyson exceed it.

 

You mean my grandfather who was actually a prizefighter. That's what they were called in the good old days. I have seen hundreds of "important fights", many of them live including the ones cited. I regret I don't attach as much significance to certain victories as you do, but I can understand the motivation as to why.

 

I can agree with this - does the subsequent question marks of Evan Field's chemical assistance throw asterisks over his HW achievements?

 

Wish I had the sport almanac and did the Quantum Leap - with a mix between Sam and the good Doc', I'd clean up on all the monumental sporting events.