Wilder and Joshua since 2020 aren't that different

If we start with Ruiz 1, Joshua's record (6-4) is:

Won: Ruiz, Pulev, Franklin, Helenius, Wallin, Ngannou

Lost: Ruiz, Usyk, Usyk, Dubois


Wilder's record (3-4) over the same period:

Won: Ortiz, Helenius, Herndon

Lost: Fury, Fury, Parker, Zhang


You'd have to say Joshua's record over this period is significantly better purely based on quantity, and Herndon being the worst fighter either man beat.


Wilder is 40 and Joshua 36, Joshua would have been 35 for Usyk 3. Wilder has mentally imploded in a way Joshua seemingly has not. Even if Usyk takes Wilder out faster than Zhang did it has minimal significance. There's no chance Wilder will be as competitive with Usyk as Joshua was in either fight.

I'd make Joshua a big favourite over Wilder at this point, whereas prime for prime I'd favour Wilder. I don't think this turd can be polished, beyond enjoying a mismatch sadistically.

 

Wilder was a real champ after beating Ortiz then had 3 more defences.

AJ was a real champ after Wlad and had 3 more defences.

Wilder had more title wins beforehand and AJ followed the Ruiz loss with a small 2nd reign but the AJ fans throwing shade at Wilder have always been throwing stones from a glass house. Ortiz was a rival of Nino Valdes hahaha but AJ barely beat Wlad in Wlads final fight then beat Povetkin and Pulev. Its 2025 and top 100 HWs are STILL ducking Luis Ortiz. He didn't suck in 2018,2019 he was just collateral damage.

Kabayel might be an ATG but Wardley has fought 2 good HWs and both times he scored knockouts when he was behind. Thats not sustainable. For all the crap Wilder got for not being good Ortiz I was Wilders only come from behind KO. If Usyk beat Wardley that was going to do nothing for his legacy because theres a good chance Wardley is below .500 from this point forward.

"There was a LOT of legitimate talk of Usyk-Joshua III and no one really questioned that it may happen. How much different, really, is the Wilder fight?"

The big reason people were mad about Usyk fighting AJ or Fury a third time is Usyk is a man whose last 6 fights are 3 sets of rematches. And the guys he rematched have held up the division a whole decade with their nonsense long before Usyk entered the picture. Wilder had a hand in the aformentioned nonsense but him being a new opponent with a more polarizing style makes it more acceptable. As does the fact he actually bothered to win a rebound fight. The fact hes taking the oppurtunity from Wardley also makes it more acceptable. If Usyk going to be fighting a guy who doesn't have a prayer of outboxing him but is going to try knocking him out might as well be Wilder. If he was taking the oppurtunity from Kabayel, Hrgovic, Frank Sanchez or Ajagba it'd be a different story. Bakole it'd be a different story. Wardley I can live with that.


If we look at AJs post title resume the Wallin and Ngannou fights were made with the express purpose of getting AJ ranked ahead of Fury H2H(possibly forever) without needing to fight him. And it worked. But when you forget Fury those wins don't actually do anything.

"There's no doubt Usyk is willing to face anyone, anywhere, anytime."

Yeah I'ma call bull on that. This makes it seem like he wants to clean out the reigning champions from the decade of ducks then peace out. Parker was the 5th member of that club and Usyk was going to fight him next to check a box. Now that Parker lost to Wardley he wants to improvise and get Wilder instead. Kabayel, Hrgovic and Frank Sanchez are all the same age as Parker and are probably better than Parker but because they were froze out so long haven't accomplished as much and are unlikely to accomplish as much before aging out. Usyk isn't giving them the oppurtunity that AJ, Fury and Wilder denied them to change that perception. Instead Usyk is going to perpetuate the idea that the 3 ducks were the best HWs of this era because it makes Usyk look better.

 

Wilder could have made stupid money from DAZN but Shelly Finkel kept holding out and being more greedy

In the end, Fury halted him and killed all his progress and big money fights. Wilder has since been trying to find his confidence for the last 4 years.

 

If we look at their last 10 fights, Joshua is 6-4 and Wilder is 5-4-1. Luis Ortiz, Tyson Fury, Dominic Breazeale, Luis Ortiz, Tyson Fury, Tyson Fury, Robert Helenius, Joseph Parker, Zhilei Zhang, Tyler Herndon.

Wilder scored 12 (an even dozen) knockdowns in those 10 fights. Joshua scored 8 knockdowns in his last 10.

Joshua's next fight is against Paul. Wilder's appears to be against Usyk.

And regardless of what anyone thinks of Herndon and his 24 pro wins, a guy who Wilder won every second of every round against, floored twice and stopped ... Jake Paul has ONE win at heavyweight (against 60-year-old Mike Tyson) and Ngannou has ZERO.

The main difference seems to be their confidence levels at this point. Wilder's is gaining, as he had a shoulder repaired after his last loss and had a good performance in his comeback fight.

Whereas Joshua is coming off a loss, and they can only manage to get him in with a podcaster who was originally scheduled to fight the lightweight champion.

Whatever edge in terms of quality of opposition Joshua once had over Wilder has evaporated.

If Joshua beats Jake Paul, the last TWO guys Joshua defeated will have a combined ONE WIN at heavyweight against a 60-year-old weed dealer.

It really doesn't get lower than that at this point in their careers.

 

Fury. Joshua. Wilder. They're all shot to pieces.
Maybe Usyk too. Which explains why he's looking to fight a shot 40 year-old who was in no way competitive against Parker or Zhang.

Honestly, Wilder wouldn't even make the top 35 heavyweights in world right now, by any reasonable measure.

 

You don't become the real champ by beating a hyped up Top 5 contender, who's best win is Bryant Jennings. The only way for Wilder to become the real champ was beating Fury and he failed to do that.

AJ wasn't the real champ either, but the consensus started to form around him after the Parker fight. It didn't form tho finally, as Fury came back.

2017 Wlad was a way better fighter than Ortiz ever was. And don't forget - Ortiz actually ducked Joshua in 2019, declining to fight him n June, when Ruiz took the chance. Anyway, AJ's resume before 2020 is significantly better than Wilder's.

Nope. He's blatantly ducking Wardley and Kabayel and chosing a washed up Wilder, who was never very good to begin with, when he's 2-4 in his last 6. Horrible look for the champion. The only worse thing I remember is Lewis dropping the IBF belt not to fight Byrd, pursuing a rematch with Tyson, who he just destroyed.

 

AJ isn't shot physically whilst Wilder is....

Wilder has no intrigue anymore that delusional wall got broken down and he's mentally frazzled like AJ.

Both Fury & Usyk are on the decline physically but are still both mental fortresses who's skill levels are so far ahead they can still beat off younger contendors (hehe beat off) HOWEVER it seems to me they are gunning for each other again but Fury will KO AJ before that happens.

 

The basically still prime AJ of 2021/22 and the 40 year old Wilder of 2026 are very, very different.

 

Thank you. It's a compliment coming from you, lol.

 

AJ's most recent win was against a 0-1 boxer (MMA fighter) - and he was destroyed by Dubois, and has been out of the ring 15 months and is about to fight Jake Paul.
As we can see, AJ is irrelevant in serious heavyweight boxing landscape right now.

...... but it's still a struggle to convince anyone Wilder's even at AJ's current level !
That's how bad Wilder is right now.

 

No. AJ was in competitive with Usyk and competitive in his fights before stoppage defeats. Wilder was RUINED and has ZERO noteworthy wins in his ENTIRE career. His best win was over a 39 y/o Luis Ortiz, literally his best win.

 

When you think about it they are also similar from a mental mindset point of view, both have been on these little soul searching/spiritual/dark room journeys in recent years

 

Holy moronic straw-man ''argument''

A third Usyk vs Joshua fight would have been completely pointless and would have been absolutely rinsed to pieces. Joshua is likely quite shot these days. however, I still doubt he’d need seven rounds to knock out a guy who, if he were British, would severely struggle to win a Southern Area title.