If Roy Jones retired after Tarver 1 would he be above Mayweather and Pacquiao

JonesJr, defeated better and more proven, fighters in their PRIMES, or should've been than Mayweather or Pacquiao, so really he should already be ranked higher than those two.
Let's look at three of Jones wins as an example. Unlike any of Mayweathers or Pacquiao's big name opponents, McCallum, Hopkins , and Toney had long and successful careers AFTER they faced Jones Jr.
Regardless of Toney's lack of motivation and out of shape, ( could be true) when he faced Jones, or Hopkins being green, ( or in my opinion, he's not an ATG) or McCallum being long in the tooth ( He was)
the bottom line is , they fought successfully for years after they faced Jones Jr. That fact indicates that all three were relatively fresh physically when they faced him.
Now look at damn near ALL of Mayweather's and Pacquiao's big name opponents.
Hoya, Mosley, Cotto, Bradley, Thurman, Marquez, Hatton, Judah, each other. Not one of those opponents were successful after they fought them.
It indicates Physically they were past primes, and each were going through that period most old fighters go through, that's win a couple , lose a couple. Getting big fights simply on name association.
Jones Jr. Was also far more dominant at his peak than either Pacquiao or Mayweather Jr. Against ranked opponents. ( Look at his total destruction of world class Thomas Tate as an example who was in his prime when he faced Jones)
Other than May Jr.s performance against Diego Corrales, I don't remember any performance of either man that rivals Jones Jr performance against Tate. And Jones Jr. Had a few like that.
Jones Jr. Should be ranked higher than either Pacquiao or Mayweather Jr. On the fact of in their primes, he faced and beat better opposition much more convincingly.
Regardless of the disastrous ending of his career when just like Ali, Duran, Arguello, R.Leonard and many others he clearly shouldn't have been in a boxing ring.

 

A win over john Ruiz is not going to do it

Only a victory over David Tua separates him from true greatness

he's CLOSE to Floyd but not quite Floyd YET

Unfortunately, a series of knockout losses did nothing for his reputation

 

Let’s all take a moment here to admire Floyd’s greatness: He spent his twilight years undefeated, beating boxing’s heir apparent in one fight and the best fighter on the planet other than himself in another. Roy, as special as he was, spent the end of his career being bounced off the canvas. There are levels to greatness.

 

this is possibly a best assessment and may in fact be the correct analyses, though my instinct might have lean with Pacman, but I don't really know with absolute certainty, except as I said earlier and you have basically said the same thing, that a fighters greatness when in peak & peak reigns, should never change because of early & late career performances...

if a fighter is better or not better than fighters x, y, z, then that's it, early & late performances don't come into it without honest & serious consideration if at all.

 

Yes. It wouldn't just have been who he beat, it would have been how he was beating them. The level he was fighting at was insane.

 

It definitely wouldn't have been who he was beating.

 

He beat peak James Toney who was #2 P4P. Not only beat him, absolutely abolutely flogged him, making him look like a clubfighter. One of the great performances ever.

 

And Mayweather easily beat Pacquiao, who was pfp 1 other than himself, Marquez, who was pfp 2 or 3, Shane, who was 3 (behind Mayweather) , Hatton, who was topt ten, Canelo, who was top ten, Guerrero, who was top ten, and Corrales, who was top 5.

Go ahead though. James Toney.

 

I rank Mayweather (#19) and Pacquiao (#20) just slightly ahead of RJJ (#26) ATG P4P.

All 3 were fantastic fighters, though I'd have Roy as the marginally better p4p at their respective peaks. I also think he has the better top 2 or 3 wins, but for me, Floyd's superior longeveity and both Mayweather and Pacquiao's superior strength in depth win resume, just edge them ahead.

I don't think RJJ's past prime defeats impact my ranking, but you never know, if he'd have retired post Ruiz it's possible I'd have been more inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt on his less deep win resume, based on his utter dominace to that point.

 

In a peak -for-peak sense, I rank Jones comfortably ahead of both. In 30 odd years of waching boxing I've never seen a fighter as good and seemingly as unbeatable as RJJ, 1993 - 2003. The problem is longevity. Jones was amazing... until he wasn't. But personally I do not judge him particularly harshly for his later career losses when he was obviously past his best, waay past his best for some of them. But unfortunately this was accentuated by the nature of some of those losses - and the length of his long, bad latter career.

 

Possibly yes. Although both Manny and Mayweather have more title fight wins, belts in more divisions and possibly more wins over HOF inductees. Then there’s Mayweather’s 50-0. It would be close

 

I rank Pacquiao highest of those three without a doubt.

 

None of those single performances eclipses Jones over Toney. Toney was unbeaten with 44 wins under his belt. He was peak and won how many rounds? Was Pac peak? I remember all the rumblings that the fight should have been mades years earlier. Pac had been separated from his senses just 4 fights prior. Shane was miles past peak which is the common criticism of Floyd.

 

I never see anyone bring up Ray Robinson or Ezzard Charles losing to club fighters in their declining years as evidence against their legacies.

 

Probably because those losses didn't happen in the age of cable tv and the internet like Roy's.

One of the worst periods to experience your career decline.

In hindsight Tyson's and RJJs declines in the early 2000s were probably factors in Boxing's popularity taking a hit in the US at that time which we're still feeling the impact of.