Prime Holmes V Prime Tyson/Prime Louis V Prime Marciano?

Timing, as they say, is everything. I think that the Brown Bomber has very few problems with Marciano and probably wins via a late round knockout while leading comfortably.

When you look at the way that Buster Douglas used his jab so proficiently to beat Tyson, it’s easy to imagine Holmes beating the Tyson of a year or two earlier. Of course, that Tyson was unbelievably difficult to beat. I believe that Larry would be able to withstand the early round whirling dervish that Tyson was an end up winning a competitive but clear decision.

 

Holmes and Louis for me.

 

Holmes beats Tyson and Louis beats Rocky.

 

Tyson and Louis
Gledavsi Louis Vs. Baer I understood that Marciano would have lasted a little longer, but once he fell (like against Walcott) Louis would not miss the chance.

Now Tyson's prime is a problem here, because already in 1989 (the year before Tokyo) he was not what he was in 1988, or even in 1987.
It's silly to say that someone so young hasn't seen primes, but in the fights with Donovan Ruddock it's clear that it's not 1988 or even 1987.
Holmes avoided his opponents anyway, that is. promoted the new IBF federation.

 

Louis dismantles the Rock, Holmes befuddles Tyson. Louis by KO, Holmes by decision or possibly RSF late rounds...

 

Rocky's great trainer Charlie Goldman was asked who would have won if Rocky had fought a prime Joe Louis...Goldman answered "Rocky"...the reporter asked "Why?"...Goldman said, "Because you don't COME AT Rocky Marciano!"...

 

Still taking Tyson over Holmes which seems to be unpopular so far......

 

A prime Holmes does to Tyson what Buster did. Prime Joe Louis busts up Marciano and stops him on his stool

 

I think Louis would win the fight against rocky. Though Louis himself admitted to hating being crowded. I think he's overall just the more complete fighter which makes sense considering due to his build Marciano was built to be a specialised fighter. Louis has numerous avenues to victory though the fight will be incredibly bruising.

I honestly think Holmes still loses to Tyson. Holmes throughout his whole career oftentimes, got himself caught lacking like against renaldo snipes and Earnie shavers. Who both had him down really bad. Holmes overcame those situations thanks to his championship heart. but Tyson is a much better finisher than both of those guys and if Holmes gets in a situation like that against tyson in his prime. Tyson wouldn't let him off the hook and probably force the stoppage.

 

Holmes, Louis.

Tyson would have the best chance for an upset.

No version of Marciano has anything for prime Louis. Washed up and elderly Louis was busting him up before he ran out of gas. Charley Goldman was just touting his guy.

 

Holmes got complacent in those two fights, though. Until he got dropped, he was winning nearly every round up to that point. Same as Douglas when he got dropped by Tyson. Both were becoming unconcerned with potential risks. Holmes would be on high alert if he faced Tyson and would win a decision.

 

1) Louis probably has to get off the deck once...maybe even twice if he gets overly aggressive or is off balance/careless. It would be one hell of a fight, but Rocky is outgunned in literally every category except raw power sheer volume when it comes to offense. Timing, accuracy, technique, hand speed, combinations, body shots, jab, all go to Louis and it isn't even close. A 137 year old Louis battered Rocky's face with nothing more than a crisp jab and veteran spoiling tactics like quick pivots (on ancient legs), clinching, framing, parries, feints, etc. Old Louis legitimately made Rocky look stupid, sometimes making Rocky miss wild punches by feet (not inches, FEET) and stumbling around the ring off balance.

I am not saying Prime Louis wins 10/10 times against Prime Rocky. Anything could happen since they both hit hard, come forward, and let their hands go. And if nothing else, Rocky had a good chin and amazing endurance so as long as he doesn't suffer a bad cut or takes too many unanswered punches, Rocky could still potentially turn things around with a sudden blockbuster blow. Louis didn't have the best chin in the world, but he had surprisingly good recovery power as seen in the Galento and Buddy Baer fights. So all I'm saying is, Louis winning by TKO within 8-10 rounds seems logical and fair. Louis probably lands like 50-60% of his punches with arguably the best overall technique the HW division ever saw. It doesn't matter how tough you are if you simply keep getting nailed round after round being willing to take a shot to land one; Rocky would be getting cut up like a Thanksgiving turkey by the end of the fight, probably gets dropped to a knee, and the ref has to save Rocky from himself.

2) Prime Holmes vs Prime Tyson? I was never 100% sold on the idea Holmes would've put on a master class performance to outbox Tyson. Even against the mediocre Renaldo Snipes, the limited but dangerous Cooney, the crude but determined Berbick, the well rounded Witherspoon, and the terrifying but predictable Shavers, Holmes had multiple moments where he got banged up, rocked, dropped, or was fighting for his life after getting caught with some nasty shots. This isn't me trying to wave Holmes off reducing him to some of his worst moments, I'm pointing out things that happened which Tyson might have been able to replicate or do even better.

On the other hand, Tyson legitimately did have trouble with a few jab-merchants like Pinklon Thomas and the night Douglas shocked the world in Tokyo had a lot to do with Douglas' amazing jab. I am not one of those guys who just ignores anytime Tyson looked bad while conveniently cutting off when his "prime" was, I lay attention to habits and tendencies. And if Tyson got blasted in the face with a good jab and he couldn't figure out how to slip it with head movement, he looked lost, confused, hesitated, or tried to simply power his way through. That would obviously be a terrible idea against the surgical veteran Holmes, and Tyson does way better when he doesn't have to think to hard and can just fire on all cylinders with instinct. With that being said, Holmes' was quite different from the men who troubled Tyson: Holmes had more of a cracking whip, while Thomas was more like a ramrod Liston jab. Douglas half his left in a more Orthodox stance and threw it a little straighter than Holmes who threw up from the waist at tricky angles with good footwork.

I think, given how much Holmes hated dealing with looping right hands, the fight might resemble the actual one that happened except Holmes lasts a bit longer. It would be very competitive and Holmes would keep Tyson honest with his underrated uppercut, straight combinations, head movement, etc, but I think Tyson eventually wears the Easton Assassin down with an accumulation of body shots, big hooks and overhand rights, head movement to set up counters, and the peak a boo guard to try to neutralize Holmes' fast but somewhat repetitive shots. This, of course, depends on Tyson and if he's: 1) in shape 2) determined to win 3) listening to his corner. Tyson even in his prime had moments where he was lackadaisical and "going through the motions" or became a bit too cocky trying to brawl/fight dirty, but if he avoids that then I see Tyson stopping Holmes in 6-7 rounds. If by some miracle Holmes goes the distance, I think Tyson would have done enough damage early to take a convincing decision as Holmes goes into survival mode.

 

Holmes rides out the first several rounds, drags Mike into the deep stops him in 11.