Let's be real about Agit Kabayel

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by catchwtboxing, Jul 18, 2026.


  1. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    No he's sitting on the throne. The HW king is in a similar situation to the CW King Jai. Both are the #1 ranked fighters in their respective divisions and The Ring champs but neither hold any of the four sanctioning org's belts. Jai is obviously much younger than Usyk and retirement is a long way ahead whereas Usyk already has one foot in the retirement door but everyone knows they're #1 though.

    Dubois can't stake a claim to Usyk's throne and neither can Kabayel, Gassiev or whoever wins the IBF belt. In fact, even when Usyk retires The Ring champion status will likely remain vacant until the others fight each other to establish a new #1

    Whilst Usyk is active which will likely be for 1 more fight he's still The Man
     
  2. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    Me too. It already is now but if he left it a few years it's obviously only going to increase his chances of doing so
     
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  3. DubbleJab

    DubbleJab Member Full Member

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    Disagree.

    You become the "Man" by beating the "Man", not by holding a Title.

    Otherwise you're claiming that Anthony Joshua's victory over Charles Martin > his victory over Wladimir Klitschko, because Martin was a belt holder.

    That version of Wlad, although clearly not in his prime, would comfortably have defeated Charles Martin.
     
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  4. Kiwi Casual

    Kiwi Casual Boxing Addict Full Member

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    That's about the lowest bar you could set tbh.
     
  5. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    Absolutely this. As long as Usyk keeps winning and remains active - he's the one and only TRUE heavyweight world chanmpion. The other alphabet trinket holders are mere pretenders to the throne as long as Usyk continues actively competing as a professional heavyweight.
     
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  6. Kiwi Casual

    Kiwi Casual Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I agree. If he goes down the exhibition route then that's another story, but either way he has earned the distinction until someone takes it away.
     
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  7. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    Yeah, I mean who else can stake a claim to his throne?

    #1 Dubois? Usyk knocked him out x 2

    #2 Kabayel? He's going to have to do something to unseat Dubois from the #1 spot before he can stake a claim

    #3 Belly? Usyk beat him x 2

    #4 Fabio? He got stopped by Dubois in his last fight

    Hrgovic and Moses are #5 and #6 respectively and regardless of who wins that one they're still going to be ranked below Dubois and Kabayel at the very least

    #7 Sanchez
    #8 Ajagba
    #9 Gassiev
    #10 Huni

    Usyk will likely retire after his next fight and then the throne will become vacant and the other champs will have fight each other to find out who the new king will be
     
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  8. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    The fact that Dubois is a 2-time "champion" perfectly illustrates the absurdity of the alphabet gang. Usyk DOMINATED HIM - TWICE! In no world can one logically view Dubois as a "champion" when Usyk still reigns in the same weight class. Usyk remains the undefeated gold standard in the division.

    I'm not convinced he will retire after 1 more, honestly. I mean, I ain't exactly Quasimodo over here, but I think we likely see him at least twice more. However things play out, Usyk will go down as a hero if he can become an instrumental player in destroying the alphabet politics that have long ruined the sport. Wishful thinking on my part perhaps. I really wish Usyk did take a page from Bowe's book and dump those belts in a trash can.
     
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  9. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    Yeah it is quite absurd. Dubois is currently and was when Usyk relinquished the belts a world champion again and ranked #1 behind him so he would be Usyk's #1 contender despite having lost twice to him via KO

    Maybe but I think he's finally been convinced by those around him that it's time to call it a day and it's only a matter of time before he loses if he doesn't. In his own words boxing's a drug and he's addicted to it. If he wasn't struggling with that I think he would've walked away after the rematch vs Belly or the Dubois rematch at the latest.

    And if he's declined even more in his next fight which he very likely will have retirement might be a lot easier for him. That being said, Zuffa might offer him a fortune to bring some genuine credibility to their belt
     
  10. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    Yep! It's simply ridiculous.

    Alphabet belts do not rank based on merit - they ranked based on who's paying the monthly vig.

    Retiring after Dubois 2 would have been as high a note as one could have, right up there with Marciano bowing out after stopping Moore. That KO in the 2nd Dubois fight was epic highlight reel stuff.

    Who do you think Usyk will wind up facing if you had to make a guess?

    Well, if Usyk's final opponent winds up being Wilder, for your sake, I hope Usyk wins. But for my old friend @Dubblechin 's sake, I hope Wilder wins.

    :smoking:
     
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  11. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    Yes, Anthony Yarde has been gifted 3 world title shots, one of them in his backyard for 3 belts vs Beterbiev, despite his best win still to this day being Euro level Lyndon Arthur and his 2nd best win being levels below Arthur.

    It was the perfect way to bow out and he really should of. A spectacular and iconic HL reel KO of the Year contender

    Probably The Dosser. He mentioned him and the trilogy fight vs Belly but unless AJ loses tonight I think Belly won't get past him him

    :lol: I actually give The Dosser a better chance of beating Usyk than any other version of Usyk because Usyk has lost a lot of speed and become a lot more stationary and his chin has got to start to crack at some point and even though he's much better defensively than The Dosser he's had over 370 fights am and pro and The Dosser has had 85 and at least half those were bums and so many were early KOs
     
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  12. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    I've suggested this (minus the chin part) in several recent videos and been accused of being an Usyk hater. :lol:

    But having created a lot of videos about Usyk, often editing clips from his heavyweight run - if you watch him in AJ 1, and then watch him against Rico - it's night and day.

    I'd still favor him against any heavyweight out there today, but the longer he sticks around, something unexpected will happen sooner or later than makes Rico look like a mere blip on the radar.
     
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  13. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    :lol: I've been telling everyone that for a long time and it genuinely astonishes me how anyone can argue otherwise and how way more people haven't noticed because the difference is glaring and you only have to watch the tape. His speed, reflexes, reaction times, fluidity, agility, and even his accuracy have all declined a lot and it was very noticeable long before he fought Rico. He used to be like a giant mongoose with super fast reflexes and reaction times.

    I would if it was the Usyk of Dubois II because even though he was slower, stiffer, less agile and more stationary he was still sharp, had good timing and looked more powerful than ever but he looked like a shell of himself vs Rico, got hit with some huge shots which will have put more miles on his odometer as would the camp for that fight and as will his next one and I expect him to have declined even more. The only positive I see for him is coming in much lighter next time and hopefully he'll be sharper and less sluggish
     
  14. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Loyal Member

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    Just a question...not going to argue it, but take it on board...

    What do you do then if the champ just won't fight the contender? How do you rectify that?

    I am in a paradoxical position because I am an Usyk nut, but I try to be consistent and have always given guys like Dempsey, Holmes and Bowe a lot of stick for not fighting Wills, Lewis and Page, respectively. I think it is just a great solution for him to have given up the titles and taken on an emeritus status (well, not an official one, but you get my meaning). Now he can fight whoever he likes.

    Now, I will say that things cut both ways with Usyk. I have said many times in defense of Usyk that there is one world, there should be one champion, and one #1 contender, so I had no problem with him not fighting Wardley. But I would agree with those who said that Kabayel was on deck.

    One final thought as a separate but related issue....a minor one but worth commenting on--when I was a kid, people were horrified that there were two or three champs per division. It is one of the reasons the sport declined, and I will never forgive Holmes for legitimizing the IBF. Now in days--the fans that were raised on it love it, and openly admit it. During the Usyk years, some of them were openly posting that they wished he would give up some of the belts so that there could be more heavyweight title fights a year. So I think, whether guys like you and me like it or not, Usyk has no chance of beating the alphabet soup boys, like you are hoping. The fans are going to count the WBC, WBA, IBF, WBO, Ring magazine, Zuffa...and maybe the IBA if their league takes off.
     
  15. catchwtboxing

    catchwtboxing Loyal Member

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    You think Wilder and Rico? Wilder and Fury? Wilder and Ruiz?