Developing stamina takes years, decades. Itauma's problems aren't simple

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Slyk, Aug 30, 2026.


  1. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

    84,477
    140,647
    Jul 21, 2009
    I'm not trying to defend Davison. In fact, I find myself routing against his fighters more often than not. I'm countering this narrative, the excuse to discredit Hrgovic, that he didn't train Moses for a long fight. It's BS and I'm not buying it at all

    I'm not trying to dump on Moses at all he's a super talent and I like him a lot. I'm defending Hrgovic who is being given zero credit by so many
     
  2. GoodBot

    GoodBot You can like, just forget your password. Full Member

    3,116
    3,825
    Jan 25, 2026
    Itauma doesn't lack stamina, he fights in a style that is unsustainable over 12 rounds: he is always tense and throws everything with 100% speed and power, and he cant do it for half an hour, no one can.
     
  3. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

    84,477
    140,647
    Jul 21, 2009
    There's only one other top HW in the world right now who I believe might have been able to stand up to the 8-9 rounds of power shots Hrgovic did vs Moses and that's Fabio.

    Usyk is iron-chinned but he's not getting caught clean with a fraction of the ones Hrgovic did and I mean even this almost 40 y/o well past his best version

    Hrgovic had to walk through fire to secure that win as a massive underdog on a deck heavily stacked against him in Moses' backyard in front of a very partisan home crowd in what was the worst possible style match up for him. I think it might have taken a lot out of him too, just like I was concerned the Big Bang fight did. But he's receiving zero credit from so many who gave him zero chance and after having been extremely disrespected going in with Jake ''Money'' Paul vs AJ odds and after being extremely gracious in victory

    He's only lost x 1 and that was to the current #2 HW in the world in a fight he was dominating prior to gassing and one which he should've won had everything been on the level. You can't billy goat your opponent's visage 22-26 times and not have points deducted and then your opponent lose on cuts. The fight should've gone to the judge's cards

    And Moses is absolutely not a hype job. He's a serious talent and I still believe he will go onto achieve great things
     
  4. The Real Lance

    The Real Lance Boxing Junkie Full Member

    9,665
    11,457
    Oct 29, 2012
    Decades is kind of a stretch IMO. i know plenty pf people who went from never running to doing 10-15 miles regularly. Even when not in the best shape. And obviously just adding more cardio for a couple of camps is ridiculous. Serious road work has to be a part of EVERY camp going forward.
     
  5. Kiwi Casual

    Kiwi Casual Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,507
    7,137
    Jul 31, 2021
    I think the issue with Ben Davidson is his tactics and how awful he is in the corner. Wardley took an absolutely unnecessary beating from Dubios and a super one-dimensional gameplan that may have permanently damaged his career.
     
    Serge likes this.
  6. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

    84,477
    140,647
    Jul 21, 2009
    Yeah but that's a seperate issue from what I'm talking about. Countless fans and members of the boxing fraternity are pushing this narrative that he didn't train Moses for a long fight and that's the reason why Moses lost. He is being made a scapegoat just like McCracken was after Usyk vs AJ but I'm not trying to defend him I'm challenging that narrative because I think it's BS and it's just an excuse to discredit Hrgovic's win and mitigate Moses' loss.

    If the roles were reversed the narrative would be what an incredible display of heart, intestinal fortitude, and unreal toughness from Moses to gut out the win and you can substitute Moses with other popular British HWs and it would still apply
     
    misd669 likes this.
  7. HistoryZero26

    HistoryZero26 Boxing Addict Full Member

    7,245
    6,304
    Jan 6, 2024
    The problem is he's a 21 year old professional athlete whose not obese. Itauma's supposed to have just about the best cardio of his life right now. It's supposed to get harder not easier.

    But something interesting about this is I've always speculated someone like Zhang was like this from the start. Tyson was. But those guys had the power to work around those problems. Moses really doesn't. How's he going to win fights try to win 6 of the first 7 rounds and hold on for dear life? How's Moses going to work around shitty cardio?
     
  8. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

    84,477
    140,647
    Jul 21, 2009
    Told you it was BS

    Fabio said Moses sparred 12 rounds multiple times in preparation for the Hrgovic fight

    But the narrative all over social media and being pushed by media members and TY channels is that he didn't and Ben Davison, who Francis Warren said had full faith he left no stone unturned, only trained him for a 6 round fight or not a 12 round one

    People are so bloody gullible. Of course Davison would have him in the best possible shape. Just 8 months ago his highly touted prospect/Olympic silver medalist Pat McCormack lost his unbeaten record to teak-tough cardio pressure fighter Conah Walker in round 12 and they sure as hell would've been very mindful of that happening to Moses in the biggest fight of his life

    Moses' older brother Karol had already lost his own unbeaten record via stoppage in an upset which Moses witnessed first-hand.

    This content is protected
     
    misd669 likes this.
  9. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

    84,477
    140,647
    Jul 21, 2009
    Scott Welch who is a trainer said one of his fighters sparred Moses in preparation for the Hrgovic fight and that he was one of the sparring partners who did the 12 rounds with Moses, as in they put fresh sparring partners in with Moses over the course of a 12 round spar, and Welch said that the last round was like the first round, with Moses swinging and absolutely going for it in round 12 not gassed

    4:35 onward

    This content is protected


    Imagine how gullible and dumb you would have to be to believe that they didn't spar for a long fight and would've even contemplated taking a risk like that in Moses' biggest fight and coronation night of his ascent to superstardom and go back and check just some of the reasons I mentioned why they wouldn't have done so. But this ridiculous copium damage limitation narrative has been pushed relentlessly by countless fans and the British sports media propaganda machine ever since Hrgovic proved them all wrong
     
    misd669 and ubareem like this.
  10. Wizbit1013

    Wizbit1013 Drama go, and don't come back Full Member

    15,557
    20,135
    Mar 17, 2018
    I can't bring myself to click

    Gad and Spencer Oliver
     
    Serge likes this.
  11. ubareem

    ubareem Active Member Full Member

    517
    707
    May 2, 2025
    It's, as usual, the disgusting British media (and everyone else who jumped on this train) trying to take credit away from Hrgovic and focusing on peripheral issues, just like Dubois' "partying" before Usyk 2. They've focused, nitpicked and gone into overdrive about Moses not sparring 12 rounds and Boxercise Ben being the worst trainer of all time - in complete ignorance. Hours upon hours, every day and everywhere, talking about Moses not sparring 12 rounds.

    They're beyond disgusting and should be ashamed of themselves, imo.

    Just give Hrgovic some credit for going through a trench war and beating this talent.
     
    misd669 and Serge like this.
  12. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

    84,477
    140,647
    Jul 21, 2009
    Yeah, it's despicable. They're despicable. This narrative was patently absurd from the get-go but it's been pushed relentlessly ever since the fight by the British boxing media propaganda machine, social media platforms both British and American, fighters, and countless fans.

    Hrgovic was brought in as the sacrificial lamb and then when he ripped up the script Davison was made the scapegoat for something that wasn't even true and so obviously wasn't.

    Fabio debunked it. Ben Davison told Rob Tebbut just 2 daya after the fight it wasn't true. And now Scott Welch has said that his fighter was one of Moses' sparring partners for the fight and was one of the ones who helped him go 12. Moses did 12 rounds with numerous fresh sparring partners and was still going strong in round 12

    What's the next excuse they're going to reach for now that one has been debunked?

    Hrgovic won the fight Moses didn't lose it
     
    ubareem and misd669 like this.
  13. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

    84,477
    140,647
    Jul 21, 2009
    :lol: I think I've come to the conclusion that I don't actually like many members of the British boxing media and just the British boxing fight fraternity in general, whether they be media, pundits, commentators, and that extends to many fighters and ex-fighters too
     
    ubareem, Wizbit1013 and misd669 like this.