88 Tyson vs. 67 Ali, who wins?

That was when he called Frazier ignorant, and it was said to be staged to promote fight. If it was for real, it was pretty pathetic.

 

Well it would depend on the context I think. People have used the Douglas matchup as some sort of measuring stick in the past, and if it's a fair and reasonable post that's fine by me.

 

Joe actually got angry with Ali's brother. It looked like something was going to kick off between them when Ali, probably sensing this, in a playful way grabbed Frazier and pulled him down. That's when the ruckus really started.

 

Tucker had never been stopped until he was stone old, many, many moons after the Tyson fight. His chin was always stellar plus he was hard to hit clean. He could not handle Tyson speed or his very underrated boxing ability, that is the reason why he lost, it was almost a complete shutout. Boneclutcher came simply to survive and refused to let his hands go. Another shut out.
If both man would have fought a more agressive fight it stands to reason that at least one of them would have not made the distance.

BTW, there were no "weak" mental moments publized in the 80's . All that stuff was totally overblown (but some of it was justified) when he got out of prison and Teddy Atlas made a career out of it. If Tyson would have died in the car wreck when he was with Givens nobody in their right mind would have called him weak or another figher could psyche him out. As a matter of fact, he was highly looked up on including commercial America for his professional attitude before fights with almost nil trash talking . He did run his mouth after some fights but that was about it.

 

Hello everybody, I'm a big fan of both Tyson and Ali. However in 1988 it took a peak Tyson 4 rds to finish off a 37 year old Larry Holmes coming off of a near 3 yr layoff. But some how we are supposed to believe Tyson who took so long to beat and older Holmes is suppose to easliy beat a much younger and prime Ali. Ali in 67 was much faster plus had far superior skills then a 37yrs Holmes, whom Tyson took 4rds to beat. Tyson fans please come up with a credible senario to explain how someone that takes 4 rds to beat an old Holmes, can beat a much better version of the same fighter. Young Ali had similar skills to Holmes but was much faster, better chin, similar reach.

 

Umm Newsflash but 4 rounds isn't exactly a long fight

 

you act like 4 rds is a long fight. and holmes went on to give a holyfield a tougher fight then expected and beat a young mercer. ali-homes is not a good example here.

 

This is comedy. I'm well aware of Tucker's credentials, I was merely pointing out that Tucker is nowhere near the fighter Ali was. You talk about "IF" they fought more aggressively, they might not have lasted the distance. Are you suggesting that Ali would fight aggressively, on the front foot even? Please. Ali was always on the backfoot because that's where he did his best work. But please, remind me, how is Tyson going stop a man who was never stopped, not even when he was an immobile fossil with Parkinsons (his corner did stop it though), a man with a granite chin, superior recuperative powers, a very defensive (albeit unconventional) style and simply a far better fighter than anyone he faced? Some people are hilarious.

 

Where did I ever say that Tyson stops Ali ? Or that he would win ? Or the other way around ?

Tyson could be bothered by a great jab thrown by a tall guy with movement and Ali was always a sucker for the left hook. Tyson sometimes could be a sucker for the uppercut coming in but he was also never down from one shot from a 185 pound guy. Pure talent they are about even and it will come down to who executes his gameplan better.

Win or loose if those two would have ever met in their absolute primes both of them would have the fight of their lives on hand.

Now as a you claimed " a simply far better fighter than anyone faced " has me puzzled. He did loose when he still had gas in the tank, I am not talking at the tailend of his career and he also got a boatfull of very questionable gift decisions.

However, now its time for you to pop in Wil Smith's Ali flick to make yourself feel better .

 

This is one of those historical time machine must see fights, right up there with Ali/Marciano & Robinson/Leonard.

Ive always said that the prime 80s version of Tyson would have the best chance at beating the prime 60s Ali...... in saying that, my prediction has always been a highly competitive pts win for Ali.

I feel his long jab & fast lateral movement would have Mike chasing him for long periods & when Tyson does get close to him I feel Ali`s chin holds up.
I see Ali`s punches hurting Tyson every now & then just enough for Ali to unleash a big point scoring flurry but prime Mike`s head clears instantly & he`s back on Ali`s ass once again landing good shots but missing & tiring too. I feel Ali will be the stronger man in the last 3rd tho Tyson will be far from spent & in the fight til the very last bell.

Ali W12 Tyson (7-5)
or
Ali W15 Tyson (9-6)


Botswana :smoke

 

Sure, but a bit too much is made out of that. Liston and Patterson both had great left hooks (especially Patterson) and neither tagged Ali with it. So it's not like he was a sucker for everyone with a nice left hook. Patterson's was arguably faster than Tyson's and he had a better reach. Didn't help him any, and he had 5 rounds to land it in before his back have out. Actually, he pulled his back when he missed by a mile with his hook.

 

A lot of people seem to be comparing Tyson with Frazier or Liston. But neither of those 2 where in Mikes league. There was never before nor since been a fighter like Tyson. He was a tremendous puncher with either hand, quick hands and feet and an all round tremendous physical fighter. Given that Frazier & Norton had Ali's number, it is fair to say Tyson would have probably done a whole lot better given his natural advantages over them. I'd say that Tyson ko's Ali in his prime.

People forget how destructive he was, no other fighter ever looked so invincible in their prime. Its amazing to watch a peak Tyson.

 

And what do you make of both Douglas and Holyfield beating Tyson convincingly?

Douglas thorougly outclassed Tyson. The only time that happened to Ali was when he was 38, had Parkinson's, was ****ed up by meds, made a comeback after being away for 2 years and fought a prime Holmes.

Don't build your case for Tyson on who gave him respective Ali trouble, because it just doesn't hold water.

 

Douglas had the correct attitude cuz of his mother dying. He dedicated that fight to her and was not going to lose no matter what. pity many of the others that fought Tyson never had the same mentality and never let him dictate the fight one sided. big-pay-check is all they wanted - Spinks is the prime example. Bruno showed a glimpse in the first then he was on survival negative fighting mode. to beat those fighters you gotta dictate them. Ali was the master of doing that. Tyson would be the one intimidated and lose by late stoppage. Close fight for the first 4 rounds then it's peak Ali's fight.