Better opposition , Ali or Evander ...

Plus Chuvalo, Patterson, Quarry..

Worth a mention, I think.

 

I think when they say that they mean beat and Evander didnt always come out on top against the best guys he fought...whereas Ali pretty much proved his dominance over all of the guys he fought in his prime and slightly past it.

 

Ali looked a lot better against elite opposition. Evander fought the best of his era and lost quite a few. Ali KO'd a prime Foreman, Evander went 12 hard rounds with an ancient Foreman. Bob Foster went up as the greatest LHW of his time to fight Ali and was KO'd, Moorer went up as the best LHW of his time and beat Evander in prime condition and lost the rematch when he was fat.

 

If we're talking about merely " fighting " quality opposition, then the two lists are pretty close. If the question is a matter of who " beat " better opponents, then it's Ali by a landslide.

 

As are Lyle and Jimmy Young; maybe Terrell.

Byrd, Pinklon Thomas, Valuev, Toney should go on Holy's list. Maybe Foreman,even Holmes. By that point, you're including Moore on Ali's list.

That's a damn long list for both guys. I'd still edge Ali based on greatness and consistency of the guys he fought. But agreed, it's a lot closer than people might think at first.

All assuming, of course, just "guys fought".

 

When the dus settles on Holyfields career and his oposition is added up he will possibly have shared the ring with more ranked contenders than any other heavyweight champion.

The only names that will compare in this respect are Louis and Ali.

What will prevent him from being ranked along side them will be that his win loss ratio will be less favourable.

 

Exactly.

 

Bowe
Lewis
Tyson
Moorer
Mercer
Qwai
Dokes
DeLeon
Rachman
Ruiz

he grant. I am sorry, but this list is not as good as Ali's.

Rahman was already exposed before Evander fought him.

Ruiz?

You can't use Crusierweight fights like Qawi and Deleon to buff up Evander's competition.
None of those two compare with Liston or Foreman, Frazier or Norton.

Evander never beat Lewis, lost 2 out of 3 to Bowe, and some even thought the unfocused Bowe could have won their second.

Dokes gave a decent showing, but he was past it.

Moorer went 1-1 with Holyfield.

The 2nd tier of Ali's guys like Bob Foster, Chuvalo, Patterson, Quarry, Foley and people like that are better than alot of Evander's list. How many of Evander's list is in the HOF or close to it?

 

If it's just about who he fought and not the state they were in, then Holyfield probably takes it. His first rate opposition is second to none: Foreman, Holmes, Lewis 2x, Tyson 2x, Bowe 3x. Then there's a lot of good not great opponents, like Dokes, Mercer, Rahman, Ruiz 3x, Byrd, Ibragimov, Douglas, Valuev, Thomas, Moorer and Cooper. As a group, i'd rate those somewhat better than Lyle, Young, Shavers, Quarry, Bonavena, Terrel, H. Cooper 2x, Ellis, Jones and Chuvalo 2x.

 

Wait Chrispontius.

How can you bring up Foreman and Holmes for Evander in terms of competiton and not Ali?

Ali KO'd George in 1974, and was shot vs a peak Holmes in 1980.

Evander fought a 42 year old George and a 42 year old Holmes. So you can't use granddaddy versions to validate Evander in any shape or form. Evander went 1-1-1 with Ruiz who is not better than Bonavena, Patterson, Lyle, Quarry or Shavers. It is just because Ruiz fought in a era where belts get handed out for nothing, which was not the case in Ali's era.

Byrd would never be undisputed champ in the 1970's.

The Tyson that Evander fought would lose to Liston and the Foreman that Ali fought, Tyson was a hype job after prison, who underdeservedly got belts back from Don King's set-ups, e.g. Bruno, Sheldon.

 

When you consider Ruiz went on to lose nearly every round to a blown up Super-Middleweight twice (Jones and Toney), it devalues the name Ruiz on Evander's record.

 

And Lyle was about to lose in two rounds to one Lynn Ball. Who cares? As i wrote in my post, if you're looking at names only, then Holyfield takes it.


p.s. nice avatar. Something aesthetically pleasing about.

 

Agreed,

I don't normally take to the bigger, more robust bottoms, but occasionally the right amount of curvature and extra padding can complement an ass quite nicely. Genesis' avatar exemplifes this rather well.