How great was Ray Leonard really?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by redrooster, Nov 9, 2007.


  1. redrooster

    redrooster Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Had some good physical equipment but not the toughest man alive when things got hot for him. I think his standing as a top welter is way overrated when I see a lofty #2 when I see the obvious standouts like Napoles (who I can't stand by the way), and others who people don't really bother check out.

    How would Ray have done in the past when he couldn't pick all his fights and had to fight often?

    Benitez the human lamb, was a passive fellow and lay down for him putting up no struggle whatsoever. The Hagler fight was meaningless so that tells us little. The Howard fight shed some light on his vulnerabilites but everyone likes to use the excuse that rust was the problem that night. Price and Green were on the way out, fringe contenders from another era and true sacrificial lambs.

    The best indicator is the first Duran fight who still had something left. i thought Ray gave a very good workout to an outstanding lighweight and naturally smaller man.

    He also showed some versatility in the Hearns fight. Even though he struggled far more than he should have, he did finally get to the hitman and overcome him.

    This would never have happened against someone like Norris who was the complete package but Id' say Leonard deserves some respect off of what he did in those two big fights.

    Historically Ray Leonard gets the ultimate sign of respect from Rooster and just breaks into the top ten.
     
  2. Holmes' Jab

    Holmes' Jab Master Jabber Full Member

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    Same old, same old ... :dead

    Leonard was probably the most complete WW in boxing history, he's a lock on for a Top 4 placing at the very least. Overall I have him at #2, only a hair's breadth behind Robinson.

    Top 10:

    1. SRR
    2. SRL
    3. Napoles
    4. Armstrong
    5. Gavilan
    6. Hearns
    7. Griffith
    8. Whitaker
    9. Ross
    10. Walcott

    HM's: Mayweather Jr, Duran, Basilio, Walker and Burley.
     
  3. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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  4. Sizzle

    Sizzle Active Member Full Member

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    SRL was an absolutely sensational fighter. End of.
     
  5. Jazzo

    Jazzo Non-Facebook Fag Full Member

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    It is too far back to tell exactly how good he was.
     
  6. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. Full Member

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    SRL was a great fighter, capable of winning big matches by boxing, slugging, or swarming. Very few all time greats could do this. The skills, durability, and speed were there. Like all the great ones, Sugar Ray LeonardÂ’s intangibles and ring generalship was top notch. Allow me to illustrate.


    Sugar Ray Leonard switched and styles after being down on points to TKO Tommy Hearns. He came up with a somewhat dull, but very effective way to defeat Hagler by stealing rounds with last minute flurries. Both Hearns and Haggler were the bigger men, yet neither defeated Leonard.
     
  7. 196osh

    196osh Mendes Bros. Full Member

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    He is the second best welter everSRR being the first and a shoe in for top 15 ATG. The fact he beat Hearns, Benitez (Top 5ish defensive fighters ever), Hagler and Roberto Duran means his record is one of the best there is.

    You can disrepect almost any fighters resume. He is a good guy that is H2H and in terms of resume No.2 WW all time.
     
  8. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    LOL :lol:
     
  9. enquirer

    enquirer Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The finest welterweight of all times,and one of the greatest p4p as well.....Defeated four genuine atgs,two at or near prime (hearns and benitez.) and the other two still being very formidable challenges.(duran and hagler.) But for the detached retina ray could have overtaken the consensus mantle of no1 p4p/welter held by ray robinson,but as time goes by most rate him no2 welter,with some now accepting that he has a claim to be no1...
    His quality of top wins is almost unparalleled,especially in such a short truncated career,and head to head he could hold his own and beat any welter in history,and he could beat quite a few great lt middles and middles...I doubt any fighter in history could duplicate the four big wins ray has against the above named opposition,robinson included....
    Ray was the complete fighter and could box,brawl,change strategy,punch,jab,outspeed,outhink,outlast,had a great chin and had the heart of a lion.....

    He could also have whipped terry norris' ass if they had met in rays prime......:hi: :rasta :bbb :good
     
  10. Bill Butcher

    Bill Butcher Erik`El Terrible`Morales Full Member

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    Take note rooster.

    This will be the last time I post on any of your threads to do with ray leonard being a bad or below terry norris type of fighter.

    Now then, SRL was the best of the 80s, the 2nd best 147 lber after SRR & 1 of the most adaptable & skillfull boxers ever period.

    He beat 5 not great but legendary fighters in the other fab 3 + benitez.

    There IS no argument here.... Leonard = Legend.

    Have a nice day.
     
  11. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

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    :D
     
  12. redrooster

    redrooster Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    why though? Why are his accomplishments so much greater than someone like Napoles' and how much to you really know of the others?
     
  13. zippy

    zippy Member Full Member

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    I see you didn't mention Hearns I.
     
  14. Robbi

    Robbi Marvelous Full Member

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    :bush
     
  15. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    I think its time cease all conversations regarding Ray Leonard, where Red Rooster is concerned. He obviously is set on his opinions, and his motivation is clearly to lure posters into debate with the agenda to antagonize them.