Are all Champions 40 and over special fighters?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mendoza, Mar 12, 2011.


  1. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. Full Member

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    When someone says so and so is on the list, the way to validate the list is to see who else is one it.

    The following fighters off the top of my head were champions past their 40th birthday

    Fitzsimmons
    Moore
    Foreman
    Hopkins

    Are all Champions 40 and over special fighters?

    If Vitali Klitschko beats Solis as expected, he will likely be the next 40+ year old champion. How would you put this into perspective?

    Some may say Vitali isn't lineal, but the lineal concept is a dying argument. I'll say this, if there was ever a boxing champion more dominant at age 40+ than Vitali is now, I'm not sure who he is.
     
  2. goat15

    goat15 Active Member Full Member

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    yes, all champions over 40 are special fighters. all of the guys you listed achieved a lot before they turned 40, so they each must have had a special motivation to continue achieving great things at an advanced age.

    hopkins is the most remarkable - he's doing it based on smarts rather than power. for me, that's more impressive. vitali is less reliant on power than the others, but he has his size. all amazing, though.
     
  3. ripcity

    ripcity Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    It also shows that if you keep your body in shape you can box at the sports highest level for a long time. It takes dedacation to do this but I don't know that it means a higher ranking.
     
  4. Boucher

    Boucher Well-Known Member Full Member

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    So, you equate Vitali Klit with ,
    Moore
    Foreman
    Hopkins
    Fitz

    ??????????


    In his 40's.Moore was tangling with,
    no2 ranked Rinaldi
    no3 ranked Durelle
    Plus, ranked heavyweights.

    Hopkins was facing,
    Calzaghe
    Pavlik
    Tarver
    Wright
    Taylor
    Pascal
    all ranked , champions, or both.

    Fitz was duking it out with,
    Gardner
    O Brien
    Johnson
    At 39, he took on the world champion ,[Jeffries] ,conceded 47lbs,and 12years to him ,and beat the **** out of him for 8 rfd,until his hands were smashed to pieces.





    Foreman was fighting,
    Holyfield
    Stewart
    Morrison
    Moorer
    Briggs, Briggs in 1997 when he was a ranked heavyweight ,not the relic Vitali met THIRTEEN YEARS LATER.

    Compare the quality of this competition against that of Vitali.

    Solis is unranked,a 17 fight novice, he as beaten NO ranked fighter.

    Sosnowski was unranked, he had beaten NO ranked fighter.
    IN fact go down Vitali's record it has no one on it who was exceptional or, very good except for a fading, disinterested Lewis ,who beat him.
    You compare the aforementioned great champs to Vitali?
    Who, with his brother, under their K" promotional banner , in the event of a defeat, insist on return clauses for every fight and, not only that, but also the first option which will be against the other brother in the event of the first one losing again?

    YOU are delusional.

    There is a reason HBO will not put on a Klitschko defence it's because ,no one outside Germany wants to see a safety first fighter go through the motions with an underserving challenger whose credentials for a title challenge are as thin as a Biafran fashion model.
    Vitali Klitschko does not belong in the same town as the four champs mentioned .
    The Klits dominate the worst period for quality, that the Heavyweights have endured during my lifetime, imo.
     
  5. JMP

    JMP Champion Full Member

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    It's a special accomplishment, but it doesn't mean you are a special fighter. It needs to be put into context and you need to look at the level of opposition they're beating. Remember, Thulani Malinga won a world title over 40...but it came by beating Robin Reid.

    Vitali Klitschko doesn't deserve to be ranked alongside Moore and Hopkins and beating Solis isn't in the same realm as beating Michael Moorer. He's dominating mediocre guys like Sosnowski, Briggs, Peter, etc.
     
  6. TheGreatA

    TheGreatA Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Glen Johnson could also win a belt if matched correctly but I'd refrain from putting him in the league of Archie Moore and Bob Fitzsimmons.
     
  7. thistle1

    thistle1 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    depending on the era, today it's more the sub standard comp level and protection that allows true talent to stay in the game, and even most of them are much less talented than their earlier greats.
     
  8. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. Full Member

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    Of course Moore and Hopkins should rank higher in a legacy or pound for pound sense. I agree its a special accomplishment, and one that has very few members in the club.

    A counter point is Moore and Hopkins had their hands full in many bouts. Vitali did not just come back. He was out of the game for nearly 4 years, had no warm up fights, and unlike the others, had to over come multiple surgeries to his knee, shoulder and back. To come back physically and mentally from injuries in any sport is tough. In a combat sport, its even harder. Vitali in his comeback has yet to lose more than a round, beating four ring magaizne ranked fighters along the way. In fact he has never lost more than two consensus rounds on the score cars his entire career! I grant you history. No fighter has ever been as dominant on the score cards. Even Ali and Holmes, two master boxers with great speed, and size advantage over most in their era dropped multiple rounds to fighters who in my opinion are not as good as Solis.
     
  9. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Vitali's recent competition has been flat-out embarrassing. We'll see how he does next time out.
     
  10. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. Full Member

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    Could? Sure? Will he? Not likely. Froch is a good champion in his prime.

    I think Glenn Johnson has had a great career. In fact when he retires, I think he should warrant hall of fame consideration. Not sure if I would vote for him, but Johnson is one of those throw back fighters where you have to admire who he fought, and ignore some of the losses.

    Who could forget his KO over Roy Jones? Jones was out for at least a minute. The over 40 champion club has not had an guy who lost multiple times in their primes.
     
  11. Stevie G

    Stevie G Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    It's partly how a fighter looks after himself,and whether their style is made for longevity. The level of competition also counts,though. A 45 year old George Foreman did very well to get the title back,it was remarkable. He would n't have pulled it off,though,against a Muhammad Ali,Joe Frazier or a younger version of himself,it has to be said.
     
  12. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. Full Member

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    I agree Sonsowski and Briggs were not the best choice, but other fighters such as Haye, and Solis backed out of offers to meet Vitali. Now Solis is taking his mandatory shot. Solis to me is a skilled guy. In the amateurs he cleaned up on Savon in 1999-2000, but politics took over and Savon went to the Olympics to win his 3rd goal. Solis also beat Ibragimov, and Ko'd Haye in the amateurs, as well as winning gold. As a professional, he is un-defeated and currently ranked by Ring Magazine.

    Solis I think is a decent opponent. You can view his full career here:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Odlanier_SolĂ­s
     
  13. McGrain

    McGrain Diamond Dog Staff Member

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    Solis is a decent opponent, I agree.

    Very inexperienced though and neither the best available, the second best, the third best...
     
  14. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    Vitali isn't a real champion is he? If he beats the Haye-Wlad winner then that would be a very good win. Foreman was a bit of lousy 40+ fighter, I'm sure at least 10 contenders of the time would have beaten him
     
  15. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. Full Member

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    We don't know that. All we know is both Klitschko's are the best. After that, you could argue multiple fighters for the #3, or #4 spot. I'm not sure if Haye, Povetkin, Chagaev, or Adamaek is #3. And Solis could very well be better then Haye or Povetkin. We just don't know.

    Solis is not inexperienced. He had a great amateur career, and has been moved pretty quickly as a pro. He is in his prime, and appears to be in better shape for this fight. In fact he has less technical flaw than Haye by a mile, and his chin can't be any worse.