20-Bout Run (Ali vs Holmes Comparison)

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Il Duce, Mar 19, 2011.


  1. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    He was well managed, but not as carefully as some other was. Lavorante, Moore, Jones and Cooper was live contenders. Especially Jones, who seemed to reach his peak at that time. Kind of risky to take on someone who'd just KO'd Folley, and, of course, it nearly backfired.

    I think an ageing Chuvalo was the best scalp Foreman had before challenging for the title, and for Holmes it was Shavers but not much else of note. Frazier had Bonavena and Chuvalo before Mathis. Tyson had Tillis before Berbick.

    Guys like Liston and Louis really took the tough route, though. In Louis' case it was also a bit cunning, though, since he took on big names that were a bit on the slide. But all in all he took an impressive route to the title.
     
  2. Il Duce

    Il Duce Boxing Addict Full Member

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    JM 36,

    Larry Holmes,,,,,,,,,what management team.

    The guy had to take $2500 to fight Roy 'Tiger' Williams in 1976.
    Now thats a RISK..
    Breaks his right thumb in the 2nd Round, wins the fight one-handed, and then
    is out of action for 9-months.
    Comes back in the USBA Tournament (he needed the cash) and is matched with
    Tom Prater (for a decent fight purse $7500), and gets criticized for not fighting a top contender.
     
  3. Bummy Davis

    Bummy Davis Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Mongol Ortiz was 10-13-0....Prator did stay the distance with Holmes but was KO'd by Coetzee and Ledoux the same year as he fought Holmes and was KO'd by Cooney and Bobick and Randy Stevens the next year

    Prator was not a good fighter, Al Jones was a build-up fighter but lost to Jose Garcia and drew with 0-5 James Youngblood just before he lost to Prator...Jones lost because he broke his hand and could not continue which he broke 3 times before....It was Prators best win but nothing to make anyone take notice...Jones also had a draw with Luiz Pires who was getting KO'd by every contender he faced
     
  4. Il Duce

    Il Duce Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Alfredo Mongol Ortiz,,,,,,,,the Box/Rec record is not complete.
    They have not added all his fights in 1975 and 1976.

    Though it was built up with a bunch of nobodies, much like a Lamar Clark.
    He still did win 21 of 22, only losing to Leroy Jones in 1976.
    Even many of his early fights are not recorded.

    Nobody is saying Tom Prater was world class, but the guy was decent up to his fight with Larry Holmes in January 1977.
    Lou Esa, Randy Stephens and Charlie Johnson were all good prospects, with
    good amateur careers, that Prater fought.
     
  5. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    Ali fought better, but you could say Holmes risked more by picking bigger fighters with more of a puncher's chance.
     
  6. Il Duce

    Il Duce Boxing Addict Full Member

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    In a fighter vs fighter matchup;
    Williams over Daniels
    Lavorante over Prater
    Moore over Robinson
    Houpe over Powell
    Jones over Arrington
    Shavers over Cooper
    Liston over Norton
    Liston over Ocasio
    Patterson over Evangilista
    Weaver over Chuvalo
    Shavers over Cooper
    London (Even) Zanon
    Jones over Mildenberger
    Williams over LeDoux
    Terrell over Ali
    Berbick over Folley
    Quarry over Spinks
    Bonavena (Even) Snipes
    Frazier over Cooney
     
  7. D9Garrard

    D9Garrard Active Member Full Member

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    Just FYI, Prater was not a "nothing fighter". I knew him personally and sparred with him when he was staff at the Indy PAL in the late 70's. Very tough, very talented, and several of his losses were "financially motivated" let's just say. He had a messy divorce right after the Holmes loss and couldn't see his kids for some time afterwards and was near destitute from what I understood. Took fights for money and knew he could make more cash as a competitive but guaranteed loser. Mercado fight was particularly rank, BTW.

    I'm not an anti-Ali guy, but Holmes' opponents look weaker in retrospect. He sought out better guys than he had to. Ibar Arrington was well regarded at the time as was Young Sanford. And who ever fought Roy Williams or Earnie Shavers on the way up? Prater was well thought of and associated with the Dundees at the time as well.