10 Years Later, No One was able to be a Five Division Champion?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by asero, Nov 17, 2020.

  1. JOKER

    JOKER You Get What You #$@%ing Deserve!!! Full Member

    731
    806
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Dec 18, 2019
    Not feelings. See his accomplishments.
     
  2. Richmondpete

    Richmondpete Boxing Addict Full Member

    5,609
    3,112
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Oct 22, 2015
    I watched his whole career. He would have never defeated a fighter like Ray Leonard. Sorry hes just not as skilled, versatile or as instinctive as Duran
     
  3. 22JM

    22JM Boxing Addict Full Member

    4,231
    3,017
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Sep 10, 2016
    Some of them were catch weights.
     
  4. 22JM

    22JM Boxing Addict Full Member

    4,231
    3,017
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Sep 10, 2016
    Joker aka pakkman actually believes Pacquiao is the goat, so just ignore him .
     
  5. divac

    divac Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    29,799
    1,051
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jul 24, 2004
    By looking at his record, he stepped in a pound over the limit in his defense vs Sangsurat and was knocked out in three rounds, a sign he had issues making weight.
    The scenario here is that Pacquiao did'nt campaign at 115 or 118 simply because he could'nt make those weights.
    Makes perfect sense, he lost to Sangurat when he was 21 years old, thats about the time a boy's frame in evolving into a man frame.

    Pacquiao had just turned 20 when he won the 112 lbs title, within a year he had quickly outgrown 112 no longer being able to make weight.

    I think as a bonafide man, Pacquiao's title efforts in a man frame did'nt start until he was fighting at 122 lbs, if he attempts at winning titles at 115 and 118 he likely loses bad like he did vs Sangurat, his body severely dehydrated from having to make the weight.
     
  6. divac

    divac Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    29,799
    1,051
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jul 24, 2004
    Who really gives a **** about it anyways........
    Ray Leonard last two World title belts at 168 lbs and 175 lbs were illegimate as well fighting Donny Lalonde the 175 lbs champion at 168 lbs, (Lalonde clearly dehydrated) with ridiculously both the 168 lbs vacant title and Lalonde's 175 lbs title on the line in the same night.

    Imo, that night Leonard won those two bogus titles is when World title belts took a nose dive in regards to their value.
    That night was the beggining of World Title belts becoming less and less valuable.
     
    IsaL likes this.
  7. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    15,793
    6,593
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jun 25, 2014
    People bash fighters like Leonard and Canelo for winning titles in four or five divisions, but at least they actually made jumps of 25 or 30 pounds.

    The guys who never seem to get bashed are the really light boxers. There are FOUR divisions between 105 and 115 (10 freaking pounds). That is ludicrous.

    On top of that, the talent pool is comically bad. How many grown men in the whole world weigh 105 or 108 pounds and are "athletic?" So, already, you're starting with a miniscule number of possible fighters.

    The way things are set up now, fighters who win titles from middleweight on up, I don't think there is a whole lot to complain about. The jumps in weight class are fairly significant. The opponents are significantly stronger in general. It's a bigger challenge. Godspeed, best of luck to you.

    Guys like Leo Santa Cruz, who move up 12 pounds and call themselves a four-division champ are who I find far more embarrassing.

    Sometimes I wish boxing would just go back to the THREE original weight classes - Lightweight Middleweight Heavyweight (small, medium, large)

    Because "all these multi-weight champs" are just grabbing belts in the satellite divisions orbiting these three, and they are just guys drying out 30 hours before the bell to pick up titles one or two divisions below.

    If you're a 126 pound grown man, and you can't beat a 135-pound grown man specifically because he's "too big" ... you're not all that great of a fighter. If you're a 105 pound grown man and a 108 or a 112 pound grown man is too big a mountain to climb, seriously, do something else.

    Basically, if you call yourself a champ, and you can't beat most fighters 25 or 30 pounds heavier than you weighed when you first began your career, you probably aren't much of a "champion."

    Because the truly great ones generally could.

    That's my old man rant of the day. (LOL)
     
    Last edited: Nov 18, 2020
  8. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The one and only! Full Member

    13,430
    1,363
    Sportsbook:
    1,326
    Oct 17, 2014
    You asked me; I maintained either this way or the other. So he didn't fight the best in Lightweight, Welterweight or Light-Middleweight, then you can't regard him there as champion, if you go to who have defeated the best (the man to beat), as neither was David Diaz, Miguel Angel Cotto nor Antonio Margarito in the division they fought. It is even questionable if Hatton was in 2008 the best in Light-Welterweight.
    But in my view matter the real titles which I prefer. Did you asked what makes the difference for me? I answered it, so you just make a fool of yourself now. In the WBU were also no mandatory defences, which make them not legit for most, so the Ring Magazine thing is comparable with this.

    Well then let us write in German, I'm sure you are better in it than me in English...:idea:

    What everyone else does is not interesting for me (many people though it is a good idea to vote for Hitler or Johnson), it is wrong which is only relevant. Pacquaio had no titles in Featherweight and was therefore challenger vs. Marquez; he didn't win this first fight so he never became champion there, it is simple as that. Don't you get it?
    Barrera lost in a non-title bout, as many champions did before without losing their titles. But you are just a fanboy who can't be objecive, as you didn't bring any argument why both views shall be applied, although them are totally contrary; as one counts official titles the other had one champion per division, so it makes no sense to regard both apart of promoting someone and make him greater than he is with some dubious records; this is similar to pro wrestling; your argumentation is like to compare Manny Pacquaio with Bill Goldberg. There is just no substance behind these numbers, you can't prove that both claims have to be counted. So you just support your allegation with the opinion of others, which are no evidence that it is correct, these are always weak arguments, then you only can bring up other peoples view and nothing else.
     
  9. Stiff Jab

    Stiff Jab Active Member Full Member

    1,231
    1,691
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jan 7, 2019
    "He didn't fight the best so you can't regard (X) as a real champion" and "He didn't win (ABC Organization) belt so he's not a real champion" are two incompatible positions and the fact that anyone has to explain this to you while you call anyone a fool is so hilarious it is sad, then loops back to being funny again. How about we just go with, "won a title recognized as a world championship," of which there is a general consensus (other than the weirdos like you) and just...leave it at that? It's simple, elegant even, and doesn't leave me trying to jump through all your silly hoops over who is and isn't a world champion based on which ABC belt they won and who they beat to do it.

    Sorry, I don't speak genocide. But it's good that you are attempting to rejoin the human race. Litte advice though? Try being less of a *****.

    Oh, I get it. You are just wrong. You're like the morons on Twitter who tried to start a campaign that "2+2=5" just to look intellectual and smug. Instead, you look like a raging idiot. Pacquiao beat Barerra for the Ring Magazine belt which has been recognized by the world as a legit title. I'm sorry that this really, really, really, REALLY bothers you, but it's true. You can argue it shouldn't (which you have...poorly) but that doesn't make it not true.

    You are the only person here with contrary opinions ("Ring Magazine isn't a real title, you can only be a champion if you beat the best...no beat an ABC belt holder! No, wait, the best!"). I don't know if it's a language barrier or you are just an idiot (but that lame attempt to bring in pro wrestling and Bill Goldberg really, REALLY makes me lean towards that last one, though), but I'm ultimately done with this. Manny's an eight-division world champion because the world recognizes him as such. You can continue to be a sad old man drinking beer and shaking his fist at whatever latest cloud has offended him, and this won't change.

    Good? Good. Now, Daddy has to go do literally anything else, baby-cakes. Try not to be too much of a raging ass-hole the next time someone bothers to notice you.
     
  10. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The one and only! Full Member

    13,430
    1,363
    Sportsbook:
    1,326
    Oct 17, 2014
    I 'm not going to read this nonsense. Just show up one argument that both can be regarded at the same time, aside of other peoples opinions!
    Otherwise recognize what you want of these, but not both the same, this is like you want climbing moutains and diving at the same time.

    By the way mandatories make title legit (at least for world wide ones), as otherwise you may defend these against you want/ any bum or just keep it without defences.
     
  11. Stiff Jab

    Stiff Jab Active Member Full Member

    1,231
    1,691
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jan 7, 2019
    This is almost completely unintelligible gibberish and you need to stop.
     
  12. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The one and only! Full Member

    13,430
    1,363
    Sportsbook:
    1,326
    Oct 17, 2014
    Well you prove you just have no argument and lost...
     
  13. Stiff Jab

    Stiff Jab Active Member Full Member

    1,231
    1,691
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jan 7, 2019
    Sure dude. Keep crying into that beer and tell yourself over and over again, while you scream at the telly every time Manny's face comes on and the announcer goes...

    "...eight-division world champion."
     
  14. Ra's Al-Ghul

    Ra's Al-Ghul The one and only! Full Member

    13,430
    1,363
    Sportsbook:
    1,326
    Oct 17, 2014
    How old are you, 15?
    Have you an argument why both shall be regarded or not? If the later, then be silent instead of bringing up groupie-propaganda, what is only what I read from you, nothing substantial, just something gibberish from others what you repeat, without evidence.
    You are a whinney kid who just say to be right because you say so; he's a 5 division champion.

    And I give you the dude between your buttocks...
     
  15. Stiff Jab

    Stiff Jab Active Member Full Member

    1,231
    1,691
    Sportsbook:
    1,000
    Jan 7, 2019
    Here, let me do it in cave speak for the last time:

    Ring Magazine! Lineal! Man who beat man! Why people like!

    ABC organizations! Shiny belts! Convention! Popular!

    World accepts both! Therefore both count! Not counting both is being dumb-dumb!

    You and which Reich?