[1955] "Archie Moore’s Weight May Be Exaggerated"

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mrkoolkevin, Nov 26, 2019.


  1. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    Any chance this was true? Would it have been possible to lie about a fighter's weight in a championship bout (and by 10 pounds)?

    Gayle Talbot, Archie Moore’s Weight May Be Exaggerated, Greeley Daily Tribune, June 21, 1955

    “The most intriguing aspect of Wednesday night’s title fight is the possibility, seemingly not too remote, that Archie Moore has put over a fast one on Bobo Olson and his advisors, having to do with the amount of weight Archie has had to shuck off to come in at the 175-pound limit.

    For the past week a whisper has been resulting(?) through local fight circles that Moore, who is known to be a slick one, didn’t actually scale a bulbous 196 ½ pounds for his twilight victory over Nino Valdes last May 2 in Las Vegas. All Archie weighted, the rumor goes, was 186 ½. […]

    And one of those who has been more active in spreading the tale of Moore’s weight duplicity just happens to be close to Kearns [Doc Kearns was the promoter of the Valdes fight]. For that reason the fight crowd is more than a little inclined to credit the yarn.

    The angle is, natch, that Olson, who still is only a heavy middleweight, was suckered into the match in the belief that he would be fighting a veteran who had been forced to punish himself cruelly in melting off close to 25 pounds in a month’s training.

    In other words, if you believe the whispers, Bobo was lured into thinking Archie would come in too weak to swing a cat with any authority.

    The new version, if true, alters the picture radically, and it probably is significant that the odds against Olson lengthened immediately after the story got around that Kearns had his feet on the scales.

    If Archie rally pulled only 186 ½ for Valdes, all the recent literature about his horrible sweating-off ordeal over at Summit, N.J. has been so much hassenpheffer.

    The wise money knows that Archie can shed 11 ½ pounds without taxing himself.
     
  2. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    From another article the same day:

    "It is staunchly believed in fight circles, by the way, that Maxim's manager Jack "Doc" Kearns has also had a piece of Moore [...]. It was Kearns, who in the role of promoter, weighed Archie for his bout with Nino Valdes at Las Vegas last May 3 and announced that Archie was a suety 196 1/2.

    The figure, you may recall, has since been questioned. A manager who was there says that he'll take an oath that Moore was at least 10 pounds lighter than Kearns made him and that the cruiserweight champ has, therefore, been forced to only shed 10 pounds or so to make weight for Olson. Kearns sticks by the original figure and you may take your choice."
     
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  3. Jackomano

    Jackomano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Archie actually was really struggling with his weight in the mid 50’s and he was fat going into camp for his second fight with Nino Valdez, so Archie’s weighing196 lbs doesn’t seem to be an exaggeration.

    Jimmy Carter, who was in Archie’s camp for the Olson fight talked about how badly Archie was struggling with his weight in camp. When him and Kid Gavilan were talking to some YA teenagers, who were in a boxing program Jimmy used Moore as an example of what happens when you play around with your weight too much and that in the Marciano fight it caught up with Moore.

    Archie has had increasing trouble scaling down as a light heavyweight. For three days before his last fight with Maxim, a year ago January, he drank no liquid, he says. The morning of the weigh-in he still was 180 pounds, and to make the 175-pound limit had to run four miles to work off the five pounds. Last June, a month before his scheduled bout with Harold Johnson, he was 30 pounds overweight and received a five-week postponement. He didn't feel he could reduce that much in time. And just two months ago, before going into training for the Valdes fight, he tipped the scales at 212.”

    “Unquestionably, this pre-fight battle with his own body is becoming too much for him. Archie himself admits it. "This Olson fight," he confided to a friend last week, "will be my last go as a light heavyweight." And, in what certainly was no understatement, he added: "Taking off all this weight...you know? It's damn killing."

    https://www.si.com/vault/1955/06/20/604845/archie-moore-vs-avoirdupois
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2019
  4. The Undefeated Lachbuster

    The Undefeated Lachbuster On the Italian agenda Full Member

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    Archie's family admitted he had weight problems in his documentary

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    I think the reports were made by people who were baffled by Moore's weight jumps. If you compare him to Marciano in their fight, they look the same size. Both are 5'11 and 188lbs, and both look like it
     
  5. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    Sounds like he didn't have too tough of a time making weight for this fight:

    From a May, 29 1955 article, "A. Moore Roars; Rocky HIding Behind Weill," Beatrice Daily Sun:
    ""So, Moore harped on how tough it was to make wight --and how tough Olson will be. But, to be blunt, Archie was talking. To himself--and he's said it around--Olson doesn't have the equipment to beat him. And as far as the weight goes, well, a couple of disinterested parties--a trainer and a matchmaker--snorted at the 200 pounds statement.

    ""I know what he weights. He is at 186 right now," one of them said. "He is conning you. This guy can make 175 pounds in a week."


    From a June 10, 1955 article:
    "I have my own methods and only once did I have a tough time making weight, That was for the third fight with Joey Maxim when I had to take off five pounds on the day of the fight. Weaken me? I knocked Maxim down twice in that fight in January in Miami and gave him the worst beating in the three fights we had."


    From a June 17, 1955 article, "Patterson's Manager Would Match Him With Olson But Not With Moore":
    "Well, at his Summitt, N.J., camp, Moore seemed to have it licked 10 days before the match. Archie wore only a T-shirt and pair of rubberized trunks. His legs, bared, seemed trim. His body was down to size."
     
    Last edited: Dec 2, 2019
  6. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    That sort of thing happened all the time in Jeffries era.

    I would have thought that a competent manager in Moore's era, would have insisted upon an accurate weigh in.

    they could certainly have enforced one if they wanted!
     
  7. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Moore came in at 188 against Marciano, which was almost certainly his best weight.
     
  8. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Never wrestle with pigs or argue with fools Full Member

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    Interesting. Do you recall any particular sources that address this?
     
  9. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Its nonsense to suggest Moore didnt have trouble making 175, or that he was comfortable there or made the weight easily. All you need to do is watch his interview with his manager Charley Johnson where they get into it over Moore having to fight Olson when he was really just wanting a shot at Marciano. It was very clear Moore felt the strain of making weight while Johnson was looking at the dollar signs. Its why he fought so infrequently at 175 after this and usually just to satisfy his mandatory obligation and did so more often than not against guys who werent that threatening. His real aim was the heavyweight title. The light heavyweight title just paid the bills.
     
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