1970 Joe Frazier vs 1980 Gerry Cooney

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mr. magoo, Dec 28, 2016.



  1. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    All comments are welcome but try not to use the renditions of Frazier who fought Floyd Cummings or the Cooney who fought Foreman or Spinks to make any cases for one or the other.. Let's keep this to prime for prime and at their very best. Also note that I didn't list Cooney as the 1982 version who fought Holmes as he was pretty inactive going into that fight.
     
  2. Longhhorn71

    Longhhorn71 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Going with Frazier....by late stoppage....if Fraizier can survives Cooney's big hook in the first 3 rounds.
     
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  3. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    Good post. We have almost no choice but to favor Joe Frazier. But physically and stylistically this is a tough fight for him. Cooney would have had a good 8 inches in height, possibly 25 lbs in weight and the longest reach of any of joe's opponents to go along with huge power matched only by Foreman's who crushed him. On top of everything else, Joe's shorter height coupled with his bobbing and weaving style and tendency to come forward mjght play right into some of those Cooney lefts to the body and head. And make no mistake, those shots were hard and would reak havoc to Frazier... Joe's heart, stamina, work rate, and inside fighting game is what gives him a chance here. If he can find a way to work the body and land some of hose ripping left hooks with any degree of regulatory, then he could break Gerry down late. But Joe was not the huge banger that some make him out to be. He was a long range pressure fighter who sometimes started out slow in the early rounds and was vulnerable before the mid point... Gerry on the other hand did his best work early... I still give the edge to Frazier but mostly on the basis of legacy... Tactically however this is starting to look more and more like a pick ' em fight... And Gerry's late career performances against Spinks and Foreman don't provide any useful insight or at least not anything useful to Frazier. Cooney was no longer a player on the world scene at this stage , but a semi-retired family man who spent his days playing golf, drinking beer, and occasionally answering the door in his bathrobe to accept a paycheck for making a ring appearance.. Going to the gym to work up a sweat was probably relegated to the weekends only at that point...
     
  4. Combatesdeboxeo_

    Combatesdeboxeo_ Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    please... a proved all time great warrior vs a nobody with crappy chin and a left hook... frazier eats him alive
     
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  5. juppity

    juppity Boxing Addict Full Member

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    This is a dangerous fight for Joe. George Foreman destroyed Joe was 6'4 225. Cooney was 6'5 225 . George rated Cooney
    2nd on the hardest hitters he faced. Rated Cleveland Willams 3rd .Number one was Ron Lyle. Foreman said about
    Cooney power " He was one of those guys who , when they hit you , it didn't hurt , but then you saw your body start doing
    funny things " Joe's bobbing and weaving would leave him vulnerable to Cooney's uppercuts , left hooks. No disrespect to
    Joe like Ken Norton i feel he will always have difficult with tall , big strong opponents. Cooney was well known for his killer instinct. Foreman when he fought Joe was in a class of his own though.For this reason Joe will be floored by Cooney maybe
    more than once , but he will prevail this time and ko a game but tiring Cooney.
     
    Last edited: Dec 28, 2016
  6. Combatesdeboxeo_

    Combatesdeboxeo_ Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    foreman did not rate liston in his top.3 hardest punchers... don't invent things... his top 3 was cooney,lyle and cleveland williams
     
  7. Combatesdeboxeo_

    Combatesdeboxeo_ Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    25 pounds of difference? joe frazier weighed a compact 206-209 pounds in 5'11 of height in his peak (ali,ellis,bob foster) and conney weighed 224-225 in a skinny 6'6 weak guy. can you subtract and add?
     
  8. Meditate=Truth

    Meditate=Truth New Member Full Member

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    I like Gerry, but it takes more than a left hook to beat Smokin' Joe.
     
  9. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    Frazier weighed 203 for his first meeting with Quarry and 205 for his first encounters with Ali and Ellis. These were his best fights and the time when he was generally considered prime. Cooney was 225 for most of his better fights and actually looked pretty good at 230 in his bouts with Brown, Chaplin and Gregg.. So on a good evening for both men it's reasonable to say that Cooney would have been "about" 20-25 lbs heavier... And BTW, he was very commonly listed as being 6'7", although a few sources have him at 6'6"
     
  10. Combatesdeboxeo_

    Combatesdeboxeo_ Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    conney was more a 6'5 than 6'6 guy, but if you say that he was 6'7 weighing 224 pounds he was pure bone, even weaker than i expected, worse for him. joe frazier also looked great at 217 1/2 against ron stander and 216 against terry daniels at 28 and it was not his prime weight . the heaviest prime frazier was close to 210 pounds against bob foster and the heaviest prime conney weighed 225 pounds.15 pounds of difference but one of them is a compact strong guy and the other one is a skinny motherfu....
    you are using his weight in the eddie greb fight at 30 years old past his prime just before to his beating with spinks, simply laughable.
    conney weighed 225 for norton,lyle,holmes and 224 for young in his peak and he was even much lighter earlier in his career,period, don't be even more pathetic and admit when you are wrong.

    frazier was absolutely perfect at 210 pounds

    [url]http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/sport-boxing-the-tale-of-the-tape-the-statistics-of-world-heavyweight-picture-id79662360[/url]

    [url]http://www.thefightcity.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/11/400px-Frazier-vs.-Foster999.jpg[/url]

    [url]http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/boxing-wbc-wba-world-heavyweight-title-joe-frazier-in-action-knockout-picture-id143825148[/url]

    [url]http://www.miketysonlive.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/11/Frazier-vs.-Bob-Foster.jpg[/url]

    cooney looked **** against eddie gregg
    [url]http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/gerry-cooney-throws-a-punch-to-eddie-gregg-during-the-fight-at-cow-picture-id161753346[/url]

    [url]http://media.gettyimages.com/photos/gerry-cooney-is-hit-with-a-punch-from-eddie-gregg-during-the-fight-at-picture-id161753297[/url]
    compare him at his peak version at 225-224
    [url]http://roundbyroundboxing.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/Norton-vs.-Cooney-Focus-on-Sport.jpg[/url]
     
  11. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    The Ron stander and terry Daniels fights LMAO.. Now there's a real good gauge to see how he performed. His best fights were fought at 205 or under. And Cooney looked just fine between 225-230. Christ he beat Gregg in one Round and you say he looked like shlt ?? Would it have been better if he had some tomato can like Ron Stander to linger for five rounds with him ?? Let's face it.. The size difference between Cooney and Frazier was collosal. And Gerry had plenty of power and potentially the right style to hurt Frazier.. I've already picked Joe to win but how you can think this is a walk in the park for smoke is beyond me..
     
  12. ZODIUS!!!

    ZODIUS!!! The certified boss banned Full Member

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    I can just see Frazier bobbing his head downwards into a big left shovel hook from cooney and it's all over
     
  13. Unforgiven

    Unforgiven VIP Member banned Full Member

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    Frazier wins, early KO.
     
  14. Combatesdeboxeo_

    Combatesdeboxeo_ Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    let's face it, GERRY CONNEY NEVER EVER WEIGHED 230 POUNDS IN HIS PRIME, IN FACT HE ONLY WEIGHED 230 IN 1984 AND 1986 and after that he was a total shot against spinks and foreman where he fought at 230 too and looked ****. HE COULD HAVE BEATEN EDDIE GREGG IN 25 SECONS, STILL HIS BODY LOOKED CRAP AND 230 POUNDS WAS NOT HIS PRIME WEIGHT.
    FRAZIER WAS PERFECT AT 210 POUNDS AGAINST FOSTER, LIKE I SAID .. 210 POUNDS FOR FRAZIER AND 225 POUNDS FOR COONEY, 15 POUNDS OF DIFERENCE, NOT 25 YOU STUPID ****.
     
  15. mr. magoo

    mr. magoo VIP Member Full Member

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    Getting frustrated are we? Joe Frazier weighed 205 or under for 7 of his 11 world title fights and of those 7 about 4 of them consisted of his best opponents who he faced at that weight. Face it... Frazier's prime weight was between 203-205. BTW, he was 209 for Foster.. Not 210... And Foster was a light heavyweight and not one of his tougher tests. I'l grant you that Cooney was past it against Greg, but in 1984 Cooney was still in his twenties and showed up 230 for his fights with Brown and Chaplin and looked fine. You take ONE fight where Frazier was 210 and make that as your case for where he'd be against Cooney. Bottom line is this. Frazier would be facing a much bigger man who had a significant height, reach and on some nights weight advantage ranging anywhere between 20-25 lbs. Not to mention the power to hurt him... I've already picked Frazier but feel that Gerry would be a tough opponent. I don't see the problem... Holmes certainly didn't find him to be a cream puff.