1973 Foreman vs 1988 Tyson

I'm not so sure, Tyson of 88 did have good movement but this was against mediocre opponents at a time when HW boxing was no better than today really. I do agree that this would be yo yo fight though with both fighters in danger of having to climb of the canvas to win, however I'd pick Foreman as his strength and good jab would be enough to offset Tyson's strengths. Foreman by KO under 6 rounds.

 

And I've disagreed each time. Tyson's power came from throwing combinations and hitting you with punches you never saw coming, but Foreman's punches were the more powerful of the two if you focused on single punch damage.

 

And I told you it's not just punches you don't see coming, it's simple physics as well. Power = speed multiplied by mass (difference in fist and glove size, ie area of impact, being negligible factor). While Foreman put more weight behind his punches, he was by much Tyson's inferior in hand speed, and this at least equalled their punching power.

 

jesus, the stupidest comment ever... being strong in the bench pres has nothing to do with functional physical strength in boxing, holyfield pushed back tyson and he was boxing in circle around foreman, evander said that foreman was the strongest fighter that he ever fought and george never trained bench press , he said that he barelly did push ups for first time in 1976 and he felt his chest great

 

The idea that Tyson is stronger than Foreman is ludicrous. I'm not even saying George necessarily beats Foreman, but he was certainly stronger and I believe he had more one punch power. And exactly how many times in his career did Tyson get up off the canvas and knock someone out?

If you think Tyson would win that's fine, but keep the analysis at least in the realm of plausibility.

 

Senya, you've graduated to wasting my time. You believe what you want to believe and I'll believe what I see with my own two eyes.

 

how many times did Foreman do that? Once in his career, against Lyle.

do you think Tyson close to his prime would get dropped or go life and death with Lyle? I dont

 

First of all I don't recall ever saying Foreman would get up from a KO and knock Tyson out, so why don't you read what I say before responding to mythical allegations. Secondly, Foreman getting up once in his career and knocking someone out is once more than Tyson, which was my point.

And thirdly, I have no idea how Tyson would do against Lyle after a fairly lengthy lay off, but obviously you do. Both Tyson and Foreman had granite chins in my book.

It was the fight of the year, so at least, if nothing else, it was entertaining.

 

Ad nauseam in fact.

 

I did point out that Frazier had plenty of functional boxing strength.

 

Foreman was not peak vs. Lyle, as the post about a long layoff & his own comments after the fight showed. It would almost be like taking Tyson soon out of prison.

Also Tyson was very strong, but as stated, there is (I would say limited, but some) carryover of strength between weightlifting & boxing. Slall point: anyone normally can do much more weight on the bench press compared to the miltary press, around a 2/3 ratio. Now steroids & weight training DID seem to make Evander stronger than Tyson in the clinches.

But for all Tyson's muscle (without having the biggest, Bruno-like upper body), he would often get pushed back in the clinches! Ali was someone who did not sem heavily musc led, but his functional strength & leverage was excellent in clinches.

Punches you do not see coming ARE a big factor, Tyson got more "bang for his buck", but FOreman if you measured the impact (or saw who could indent the most massive bag sooner with the same massive weight heavybag) Foreman would hit harder. And as MANY have observed, Foreman did not even seem to have the best leverage-weight behind his punches, yet his technique worked for him. Tyson sure seemed to have his weight (& snap) behind his punches.

Fist size is not negligible. ONE way to generate force is leverage through long arms & Foreman's wide arcs. It is not so simple as mass X speed. Just as hitting a ball very far or throwing very far or fast. Some men have-& develop, but much of it is natural-tremendous concussive power beyond what you could predict.

How come FOreman hits harder than almost everyone without great speed or unusual weight for a heavyweight? Why Liston, not heavy, whose jab equaled most HWs haymaker, when he was pretty slow? Shavers was not large & not particularly fast, yet he is the best candidate for heaviest hitter ever.

But due to his lack of skill, effective combinations, endurance, chin...This did not translate into top 1 punch KO power. But a remarkable KO man nontheless.

His long arms, huge fists, commitment to punches, technique, & God given talent made him a monster hitter.

 

Hard hitting and heavy hitting are different things. Foreman's punches were heavier, Tyson's were as hard as Foreman's or harder.

 

Nope, I see no reason Tysons were as hard or harder. Both hit extremely hard, speed & heavyness & heavy handedness & few elements make up power. Joe Louis had blinding combinations & was a superb puncher, but like Dempsey & Frazier, hit very hard by a normal standard of HW, not compared to Tyson or certainly Foreman.

 

The point im trying to make is, you asked the question of how many times Tyson got up to win a fight, i dont think Foreman should be held that higher in regards just because he got up off the canvas against Lyle, a guy who i personally dont see dropping let alone beating Tyson.

Tyson never got up to turn a fight around he was losing, well neither did Ali, nor Lennox, nor Holmes, nor Wladmir, neither did Foreman for that matter (unless you count the Lyle fight as a fight he was losing).

And to my knowledge Holyfield never got up off the canvas to turn a fight round either (unless you count the Cooper fight as a fight he was losing).

The fact is all of the above, bar Tyson, were dropped by a punch, Tyson was never dropped by a single punch but normally took a long sustained beating.

Getting up via a one punch KD is a lot easier than a long 8-11 round beating.

 

not it were not, evander faced both men and said that foreman did hit clearly harder, you can say what you want. plus i have eyes... i don´t need any testimony, foreman moved the body of bert cooper around 1,5 m around the ring ( similar to tyson) like a toy with a single body shot