1985-86 Larry Holmes vs 1952 Archie Moore

He states 1952 Moore.

If we matched them P4P that would be a different fight altogether. Moore is an awesome fighter. If he were born to fight around Holmes weight he'd be favored i reckon, surely. I'm talking best for best too.

 

I know he didn't state it, but when we're talking about cruisers and light heavyweights facing the big guys, it seems unspoken that they get the additional weight for it to be fair.

 

They don't unless it is stated. Moore had loads of heavyweight fights and the thread pits a good version of Moore against old Larry. It's a straight up H2H. I was shocked when you were so sure Holmes, even old Holmes, couldn't win by stoppage. Now i know.

 

And now I agree with you. Heh.

 

he literally beat numerous men as big as Larry. Larry literally lost to a man under 200…

 

He beat no heavyweight of Holmes ilk or even close and that's talking aged Holmes. Spinks was literally 1/4 of a pound under 200. Moore came in under 190 in two attempts to win the heavyweight crown.

Moore doesn't have the wheels to beat Holmes at heavyweight.

 

Larry won zero significant fights at the age set. None. He didn’t win any a few years prior nor after. Moore on the other hand beat the pants off of similar size men in Baker and Nino. He almost lost to a not as skilled and old Norton. Larry was a shell of himself by then. He has no chance beating a prime Archie

 

Noway in the world. Moore beat the pants off guys not even close to as good as old Holmes and vastly different types of fighters.

Baker? He was light punching and had won just 6 of his previous 11 fights. Included in that was a KO loss to the 184 pound Clarence Henry, 4 fights in a row with someone named Billy Gilliam who was 29-12-2 at the start of said series, a KO loss to Bob Satterfield where he lasted 2 1/2 minutes. It's fitting that one of the few blokes he beat was none other than Nino Valdes. Valdes was in the midst of a four fight losing streak when he fought Moore the first time.

Chalk and cheese. Old Holmes all day long after being pushed to sum it up further.

 

The problem is ur comparing old Holmes to the equivalent of prime Holmes. Stop confusing the two. Old Holmes beat no one on par w the great wins Baker and Nino had.

 

No i'm not and i am not confusing the two. I've addressed Baker and Valdes above. they simply weren't all that to put it mildly.

Old Holmes would have whooped that pair. Valdes would have been somewhat similar to the Bonecrusher fight and Baker would have been far easier than Carl Williams.

 

Christ, prime Holmes would make minced meat of Moore. It would be a mismatch.

 

Old Larry didn’t garner many wins those days. Once again ur heart is confusing ur head. He was not very good by then and there is zero evidence that he was because he didn’t garner any win in years. A far less skilled and ancient Norton w his cross arm defense gave Larry a life and death fight. A prime Archie is likely to knock him out

 

I’m not picking against Holmes but it is a valid thing to say he did nothing impressive between about 1983-86. He arguably lost to novice Witherspoon & failed to clearly beat Spinks (I had him winning the return fight by only one point). I don’t support it but it’s not outrageous to think Moore could beat the Holmes of 1985-86, IMO.

 

Old Holmes was never beaten until Spinks. He was finding ways to win. Even years later he beat Ray Mercer.

My heart is fine, i often go against Holmes. Your rose tinted glasses for the "heavyweights" of that era is the difference. You are the only one to vote for Moore whilst 10 of us have voted for Holmes, half by stoppage.

Stylistic elements are still getting ignored. Norton was hell for boxers (i'e'. Ali/Holmes/Young) and tho certainly aged vs Holmes one can safely state Holmes was pre-peak as well. On top of this Norton is nothing like Moore. He was a whopping 37 pounds heavier than Moore ever got to in his 1952 heavyweight fights as well as taller and longer.

Holmes struggling with Norton has no bearing on Holmes - Moore.

Moore is a good heavyweight but a long way from a great one.

Moore has NO chance of knocking out Holmes, none.