5 vs 5 Boxing vs BJJ

Discussion in 'MMA Forum' started by POTUS, Feb 18, 2019.



  1. kirk

    kirk l l l Staff Member

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    So because one of if not *the best* bjj practitioners on earth beat one or two mid tier boxers it means boxing is useless vs bjj?


    As long as 100% of fights start on their feet... and involve two people closing distance on eachother within striking range... boxing will never be 'useless'.


    As always, it will come down to who is using what style, and against who.
     
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  2. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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  3. kirk

    kirk l l l Staff Member

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    While theoretically I agree with you, that IF Khabib was smart, and had it absolutely brainwashed into him to go straight for a takedown as fast and as relentless as he can, and attempted zero strikes, youre right... I dont think any boxer could beat him.

    But... neither could anyone else.

    And in the same way Khabibs dominance against other mma fighters isnt an indicator of how other wrestlers would do in mma, (because the attribute that his success is built on, his strength... and conditioning... isnt shared by all wrestlers) is the same way its not a basis on how other wrestlers would do against other boxers.

    Exceptions (khabib being exceptional) doesnt make the rule (boxing being useless against grapplers)

    And him being the best is certainly not a basis for saying boxing is useless against bjj, when considering bjj and wrestling have different approaches to establishing control over a striker (I feel elite level wrestling is superior in that regard... as in.. I think a boxer would have a less opening and less time against an elite takedown attempt from a wrestler than he would against bjj)


    Sidenote :
    Heres where Khabib being theoretically unbeatable against a boxer seperates from him actually being unbeatable.

    Khabib spends *plenty* of time on his feet trying to establish his striking with his opponents... I have absolutely no reason to think someone like Canelo or Golovkin wouldnt cave his face in as hes trying to strike with them like he always does.

    If he fights like he always does... he is indeed beatable by an elite boxer. He spends way too much time trying to establish his striking and, in reality, is very vulnerable at getting sparked or rocked while doing so.

    But yes... he would be the overwhelming favorite and if he fought uncharacteristically smart and reserved he should win all the time. But thats not Khabib.

    Anyways... to each their own. This debates been going on for over two decades now... im sure it wont end anytime soon.
     
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  4. PIRA

    PIRA Boxing Addict Full Member

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    LOL boxer uses rear naked choke in the footage.

    Brazil win by DQ. ;)
     
  5. Birmingham

    Birmingham Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    They weren't even that, just bar brawlers/tough men some of the fights I seen Gracie against !
     
  6. DJN16

    DJN16 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    If you fail to realise Art Jimmerson was completely shot as a fighter from his own discipline.... And then defeated in an MMA bout vs a top operator from another discipline....... And are using that as your theory........then we have problems.
     
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  7. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Early MMA fighters hasdn`t learned to defend against being grabbed by someone with BJJ skills or what to dso once they had a hold of them on the floor it was game over, as time went on they got wise via coaches who adapted martial arts into one another, it wouldn`t have mattered what age that guy was at all.
     
  8. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Khabib used a couple of kicks against Conor and GGG and Canelo would be weary of being kicked or grabbed mking them hesitant, his footwork helped him v Conor and he punched well, one kick to a boxers legs and it`s all over, theydion`t know how to defend against kicks to the legs, their legs are weak compared to MMA fights and they can`t take leg kicks, this is pointles, twodifferent sports, who cares about this nonesense?
     
  9. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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  10. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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  11. mark ant

    mark ant Boxing Junkie Full Member

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  12. kirk

    kirk l l l Staff Member

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    ah yes.... typical propaganda.

    Arthur was a 38-10 record padder when this fight took place who went 2-3 in boxing the very year this took place, a guy who was brought in to get dusted by Haye in his 9th fight, with his wins coming over the likes of 7 wins 11 loss Harvey.

    Bringing in and beating boxers who cant make it in their own sport anymore is pretty much par for the course in mma, but unfortunately it doesnt mean much outside the minds of the mma fans that buy into the hype.
     
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  13. PIRA

    PIRA Boxing Addict Full Member

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    But there were circus promotions in boxing well before MMA - Ali /Inoki, multi opponent bouts televised in the 70's, you can go all the way back to Jack Johnson and probably before to find a boxing promoter willing to sell a carnival.
     
  14. richdanahuff

    richdanahuff Well-Known Member Full Member

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    You don't know what you are talking about the Gracies set conditions in every fight that favored them they made it nearly impossible to win for a striker or a wrestler by establishing rules for their success...marketing 101...I have trained with Royce and some of their other guys we brought down for the Army program I am a H2H instructor the MAC it is based on BJJ.....under normal street conditions BJJ is not what you want to depend on and even they knew enough to learn striking and advised being able to fight on your feet...they sold a product and those prone to cults bought it hook line a sinker....go to the ground in Brownsville NY or East LA...S Phoenix, Houston they would love you to grapple to the ground or against a wall so their homies jump in even easier...I also wrestled for several years on top of boxing....Now I see why you are so annoying on the classic forum and hardheaded....this is an example of how a gang fight would go if the athletes were restricted to knowing 1 fighting art and as you can see getting punched by a decent not great striker is pretty efficient at green flashing and hurting the grapplers enough to stop their ability.

    There is no decent MMA fighter today does not train extensively on striking without it Khabib one of my favorites would not even make the roster....most wrestler I know in MMA like Tim Kennedy we were in the same unit hated BJJ because of the cultish following of the Gracies and the fact that laying on the ground in a street fight a real one like an old man is stupid nd misleading
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2019
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  15. richdanahuff

    richdanahuff Well-Known Member Full Member

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    He was a barely trained amateur boxer and an old man in this fight not to mention the size difference and proved that going on the assault is the best defense against an ******* bully and when their were no rules we see what happened
     
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