80s Tyson vs 80s Holmes

If they were to fight in their respective peaks I would go with Holmes.

 

It’s worth noting that Holmes never once faced a top notch finisher prior to Tyson. A lot of people praise his recuperative powers when hurt, but against…a winded Shavers? Snipes? I don’t know that he’s as proven in this regard as many consider him.

 

I mean, I don't even see Tyson getting through to Larry, really. He's simply proven to have the heart to get up against big, thunderous punchers, which Tyson isn't, comparitively.
Tyson was a scary and ruthless combination puncher, very lethal in the ring, but not what Holmes would fear.

 

I can see both sides of it. Holmes was twice the fighter Douglas was, even in Tokyo. But Tyson was galaxies superior as a finisher to anyone Holmes survived, & much lesser fighters found his chin or worked him hard.

As I said earlier, 50-50 in my book. Holmes is far ahead on my list though, ranking on achievements.

 

You're having a laugh. Witherspoon and Norton superior punchers to Tyson???? No mention of the great Renaldo Snipes? Weaver?

Tyson was three times the fighter Shavers was and a more "dangerous" puncher because he was simply so much better. Trying to box Tyson as a non brutal puncher whose effectiveness was due to combinations and not power is insane. Tyson as a huge puncher enhanced by his sheer handspeed and combination punching.

You don't think he'd be able to hurt Holmes the same as those guys? Past prime or not Holmes shipped a great punch all the way to the end and Tyson sure showed he had the power to hurt him.

 

Yeah. Just when you thought you'd heard it all...

 

Smells like satire it’s so far out there. I’m not completely sure though.

 

Maybe it is...i'll have a look at a few more posts tonight.

 

Strength wise, superior punchers to Tyson. Holmes was weak to big, destructive punchers like Shavers just as Ali was weak to more explosive punchers like Frazier- It's why Holmes was dropped by right crosses whereas Ali was dropped by left hooks.
Tyson was a better combination puncher than any man Holmes had ever faced, in his prime or not, that's true, but that's not what I was arguing against.
You also seem to mention Tyson as the better fighter to Shavers as if I made a claim against that, and with all three men I mentioned, you can clearly see that I was explicitly talking about punching power.

 

Tyson's always got a chance, but this isn't one I'd pick him for.

 

There can be a huge difference in rating Fighters by Career Resumes and head to head. Head to head, I have to believe Tyson wins most times against Holmes.

 

I agree that career & head-to-head differences can be very substantial.

 

You underrate Tyson's power to a shocking degree.

Frazier is the most effective left hooking heavyweight in history, of course anyone that can't get him out of there is going to struggle with left hooks. Holmes would have too. He fought no-one remotely like Frazier and no-one remotely as good in his prime.

Holmes was not "weak" to big destructive punchers just like Ali wasn't "weak" to more explosive punchers. Holmes was hurt badly at times by left hooks and Ali was hurt badly at times by right crosses. Your comments are rigid and blinkered.

I mention Shavers ability as he was a very poor finisher, quite the opposite of Tyson. Getting off the hook when hurt against Tyson was a much different proposition.

 

The Mike Tyson of 1985-88 vintage was a FORCE--man he was something in those years! As sound a technical fighter as Holmes was with that great left jab I think Tyson's explosiveness would be too much for Larry to deal with--and he eventually goes down. KO or stoppage 8-10 rounds tops!

 

That’s a much glossed-over point. Holmes gets too much credit for mine in regards to his recuperative powers. They were on display against extremely limited guys like Shavers (winded, no less), & Snipes (not a lot of power, or ability). That isn’t to say Holmes didn’t have strong recuperative abilities - he passed the tests that were given to him - but the tests don’t tell us enough, IMO, to be as sure as most people seem to be.

Holmes was significantly better than even Tokyo Douglas, & would have fought Tyson in a similar fashion (& yes, I accept Tyson wasn’t at his best that night), so a Holmes win, for me, is no worse than a 50-50 proposition - but the only time we saw him in serious trouble against any kind of first-rate puncher & finisher was against Tyson - too late to ascertain much.

It’s a great shame when you think about it that Tyson didn’t come along just five years earlier. The division, & in a way, even Holmes, needed him.