A deeper dive on Emile Griffith's greatness.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Ioakeim Tzortzakis, Sep 20, 2023.


  1. Ioakeim Tzortzakis

    Ioakeim Tzortzakis Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Emile Griffith is one of those fighters that got thrown into the wolves very early in his career. And he is one of the rare fighters who managed to beat them. Aside from a close decision loss against Randy Sandy, he had already proven himself as a very good prospect before the 60's. Only 2 months into the decade, he managed to beat the #8 rated Welterweight Gaspar Ortega. Then, he won and lost in two very close fights against the #4 rated Denny Moyer. Then he won in another close call against #9 rated Jorge Fernandez, before closing the case and showing his superiority in the rematch. #8 rated Florentino Fernandez and contender Willie Toweel were also soundly defeated.

    Then he managed to win against the #1 rated Welterweight contender, the great Luis Manuel Rodriquez, before winning the Welterweight title against Benny Paret in the 13th round against him. Previous victim Gaspar Ortega was stopped in the 12th in his first title defense. He also managed to defeat the #7 rated Middleweight, Yama Bahama, prior to losing the title to the man he got it from, Benny Paret.

    After that, he defeated the declining Isaac Logart, who was one of the best Welterweights in the world in his prime, only 3-4 years prior, frequently being ranked in the top 5 and top 3. Then, the infamous incident when Griffith killed Benny Paret in the ring for calling him a homosexual slur, thus regaining the Welterweight title. Griffith then proceeded to defeat the #3 rated Welterweight Ralph Dupas, #6 rated Middleweight Denny Moyer, rising Middleweight contender Don Fullmer and gained the inaugural and then unofficial World Junior Middleweight title against Ted Wright.

    He made a succesful defense against the #5 rated Jorge Fernandez, and then lost the Championship again, this time to the great Luis Manuel Rodriquez, before retaining it again and becoming a 3 time Welterweight Champion by defeating him in the rematch. He then defeated the borderline shot Holly Mims, who was once a top Middleweight contender and the #10 rated Middleweight Jose Gonzalez, before losing in an upset against Rubin Carter, being defeated in a single devastating round.

    #4 ranked Welterweight Ralph Dupas fell in 3, #10 rated Welterweight Stan Harrington fell in 4, and the amazing #1 contender Luis Manuel Rodriquez would fail to win against him, with Griffith winning the bout and the series 3-1. #3 rated Welterweight Brian Curvis would also fall really short of winning. The #1 Lightweight contender, Dave Charnely, would move up to Welterweight to fight Griffith and would get stopped in the 9th. Griffith would then lose to Manuel Gonzalez, who while a good Boxer, only had one significant win in his career against Moyer at this point, and had no business beating Griffith.

    Griffith then beat the #2 rated Welterweight contender, Jose Stable and the #9 rated Welter, Eddie Pace. He then lost to former victim, the underrated #8 rated Middleweight Don Fullmer. Fringe Welterweight contender Gabe Terronez would fall in 4, and then Griffith managed to avenge his former loss to the #2 rated Welterweight, Manuel Gonzalez.

    Then came the big one, arguably the single greatest win in Griffith's resume, his win against the Middleweight Champion, the great Dick Tiger. Then Griffith twice defeated the #2 rated Middleweight, the excellent Joey Archer, back to back. He then lost, reclaimed and then again lost the Middleweight title against the also excellent #1 rated Middleweight Nino Benvenuti. He then became the only man to defeat the undefeated and rising contender, Gypsy Joe Harris, sending him into retirement. He would then proceed to lose against the rising contender Stanley Hayward, sending him out of the top 3 of the Middlewight division.

    He then was utterly thrashed by the all time great Jose Napoles, winning a very minimal amount of rounds. This is where many fighters would call it quits, but Emile Griffith still had some fire in him. He won against the #8 rated Middleweight Doyle Baird, the #4 rated Tom Bogs, the #5 rated Light Heavyweight, Dick Tiger in their rematch, fringe Middleweight contender Nate Collins, #10 rated Middleweight Rafael Gutierezz, and #5 rated Welterweight, Ernie Lopez. He would then fight and lose to the great Middleweight Champion, Carlos Monzon.

    It was obvious after that, that Emile Griffith was not the same fighter he once was. And his record against top rated fighters showcases that. He did manage to defeat the green and still unranked Armando Muniz, a future top contender, as well as Ernie Lopez again, but it was mostly failures after that. He would lose to the #4 rated Middleweight, Jean Claude Bouttier and to the Champion Monzon again. He would get an MD win over Manuel Gonzalez, who was just as shot as him, and then would lose back to back against #1 and #7 rated Middleweights, Tony Mundine and Tony Licata, although he did manage to defeat #3 rated Bennie Brisoce a bit later, but would then lose to the also #3 rated Vito Antuofermo. His last victories over rated fighters were the much smaller #9 rated Junior Middleweight Donato Paduano, and barely even fringe contender Leo Saenz.

    He would proceed to lose against the unremarkable fringe contenders Elijah Makatiniand and Loucif Hamana, the #1 rated Junior Middleweight Eckhard Dagge and finally to future Middleweight Champion Alan Minter, before retiring for good.

    @Journeyman92, This is my early christmas present to you. Hope it satisfies your tastes. Maybe I'll even manage to do a good Napoles one in the future, I tried once, but it didn't go too well, so I did not end up posting it. But things might be different in the future, so watch out for it.
     
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2023
  2. klompton2

    klompton2 Boxing Junkie banned Full Member

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    Its even more impressive when you consider that his losses to Sandy, Paret, Gonzalez, Fullmer, Benvenuti 3, Licata, and Hayward 1 could have all gone the other way and that he was flat out robbed in his fights against Bouttier and Cohen.
     
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  3. Eddie Ezzard

    Eddie Ezzard Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Brilliant post as ever. What struck me was what he kept coming back from. Losing the title, being involved in a ring fatality, losing the title, the pressure of being gay in the world and era he lived in, a devastating 1st round kayo loss. All potential career-ending forks in the road which he just strode straight through. Amazing man.
     
  4. Melankomas

    Melankomas Prime Jeffries would demolish a grizzly in 2 Full Member

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    Great work, you should do Fitzsimmons next
     
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  5. Ioakeim Tzortzakis

    Ioakeim Tzortzakis Well-Known Member Full Member

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  6. Saintpat

    Saintpat Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Also of note, Emile fought in 13 countries (if my count is correct) plus three territories (Puerto Rico, U.S. Virgin Islands and Bermuda).

    A true have-gloves-will-travel road warrior.
     
  7. Mike Cannon

    Mike Cannon Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Hi Buddy.
    I would like to say a huge thank you, as would most of the posters I would imagine, the depth and breadth of your piece is quietly impressive, not just the bare results and facts, we can all do that, but an inside to the fighters he fought, and their status at the time he fought them that takes a rare insight to accomplish, I had, for reasons I can't explain not given Griffith the credit he fully deserves, maybe his lack of punching power, maybe he wasn't " colourful " enough, but what he was ( and I should have known better ) was a truly exceptional fighter, up against the bigoted thinking of several eras, to his credit he stood tall, and in a boxing, perceived as a very masculine sport , proved that your sexuality matters not a jot, as it should do in life, once again thanks.
    stay safe guys.
     
  8. Greg Price99

    Greg Price99 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Another fantastic OP from Ioakeim Tzortzakis and a great poster from you Mike, you're a wise man.

    Having recently read Donald McRae's brilliant biography on Griffiths, "A man's world", Emile was my answer to a recent thread on which fighter should have a film made about their life. An example of the truth being more amazing than fiction.
     
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  9. Mike Cannon

    Mike Cannon Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Hi Greg.
    Appreciate the nod, you know what mate, over the years that I have been on the forum, its has changed, and changed for the better, of course their will always be the ignorant, foul mouthed brigade, devoid of manners and protocol, which cost nothing, not so much these days I would profor, would like to think they have seen the error of their ways maybe, or saw the many good mannered posts and was bought on side, whatever the reason, the forum now, and going forward is a welcoming, safe, tolerant, portal with which the committed boxing fan can exchange friendly informative conversations, with no fear of being put down, or derided for their honest opinions, we, and I include all the nice friendly posters that you and I enact with, are winning, it has been worth it.
    stay safe buddy.
     
  10. Gui Dosnera

    Gui Dosnera Member Full Member

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    Keep these threads @Ioakeim Tzortzakis, great, great stuff!
     
  11. LWW

    LWW Member Full Member

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    Met Emilie when he came to Sydney as trainer for Juan Laporte vs Kosta Tszyu fight. Such a likeable gentleman and left impression on the whole gym .
     
  12. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 Bob N Weave Full Member

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    I’m a great fan of Emile and I write this under a signed framed photo of the man - could you tell me everything?
     
  13. LWW

    LWW Member Full Member

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    Emilie had come with Laporte to put him through some drills after long flight from the States. Emilie was so humble and before he visited i was a fan but even bigger one after he left.
     
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