A fighters 'Lineal' claim.. Check this out!

Yes. As long as you can and still have intentions on fighting at the weight. It's only when you can no longer make the weight class anymore that it gets vacated.

 

I never said Miranda was the *best* Middleweight I ever saw since Gerald McClellan. I said he was the *hardest punching* MW I've seen since Gerald McClellan. You do know the difference, yes?

 

Fight hasn't happened yet, Einstein..

 

Usually when a lineal champion moves up, he states his intention to leave the weight class. In such an instance, his lineal title becomes vacant. However, there are instances where lineal champs move up [or even down] and do NOT vacate their lineal claim. When Pernell Whitaker was the lineal champ @ 147 - he moved up to 154 to win a title there. However, he did not vacate his status as the lineal WW champ and returned to 147 and defended his title.

 

Thee real champion of a division cannot be a fighter who has never fought at that division. That claim is completely nonsensical.

No, he got handed the title because the guy who spuriously held it handed it over and left the division because he didn't want to defend it against him.

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The whole ideal of a "lineal" champion is absurd. In effect, if you support this then you are claiming it is perfectly acceptable to have a champion who can go for years without defending the title, pick and choose whatever rubbish he wants to defend against, completely refuse to take on any worthy contenders and leave the best contenders, who will fight any beat anybody, with no way of becoming world champion and no means of forcing a title shot? Again, the whole idea is against everything that any right-minded boxing fan would stand for. If a champion refuses to fight a worthy contender then it is absolutely right that he should forfeit his right to be called champion.

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No it doesn't. Canelo doesn't fight there. His last fight was at 154, his next is some 164 1/2 catchweight.

You're comparing apples and oranges, a bygone era where there was only one champion and he would defend against all comers rather than finding ways to avoid top competition. As I said, the whole idea is a silly abstract concept which has no importance other than allowing fanboys with agendas to push to claim legitimacy for fighters who are no kind of champion whatsoever.

Really? Feel free to provide me the name and address of the sanctioning body which recognises it, a list of their senior officials and a link to the body's rule book.

Which isn't middleweight. Middleweight is 160lbs

Exactly. If the "lineal champ" was an official championship in any way then there would be.

Nowhere does it say anything about what constitutes or doesn't constitute a lineal champ. The reason being that it is an abstract concept made up by a number of fans and not an official status. Again, there is no such thing as a "lineal title fight", no official status of "lineal champion" nothing. You said above that "there's not an actual rule for what determines a lineal champ" and then in the next paragraph are trying to invent a list of "rules" for what determines a lineal champ. There are no rules because it is not a real championship. The middleweight limit is 160lbs and, as you're so fond of your history, it has been since the division was created. Therefore, it is self explanatory any legitimate fight where middleweight supremacy is at stake needs to be at the weight of 160lbs and where both fighters are allowed to weigh in at anything up to that weight. Just because some of the sanctioning bodies allow fighters with wealthy promoters to bend the rules by imposing catchweights on their opponents in exchange for big paydays, doesn't mean that we as fans should tolerate such nonsense.

Again, it is NOT an official status, there is no sanctioning body which recognises it and no rulebook by which it is fought. Therefore, the whole concept is meaningless. I am not a huge Golovkin fan, though I respect him, I am simply a fan of the sport of boxing and want what is right for the sport. You are obviously a huge Canelo fan, hence your ludicrous claim that he is a legitimate champion in a division he has never legitimately fought at and where there is a fighter who has a far stronger claim that he does to any logical observer. I accept that Saunders also has a claim, however, given the number of belts held by each and the number of top contenders beaten, Golovkin's is obviously stronger.

I will wait for you to send me the address of the organisation which administers this "official" status of lineal champion and the rule book by which they operate. I suspect I'll be waiting a long time.

The final word is simple. Because there is no official status of "lineal champ" and no official rules for how one is determined, it comes down to the interpretation of the individual. So as a fan, do you believe it is good for the sport that a fighter should be able to hold a belt ransom for years and defend it against nobody at all or mediocre fighters, whilst deserving contenders are not able ever to force a title shot? Or do you believe that a champion should defend the belt against all comers and deserving contenders should get a shot? Do you believe that fighters with significant financial backing should be able to use that backing to bend the rules and rig the dice in their favour? Or do you believe that the rules should be the same for all and that to become a champion you should play the rules? Do you believe the stronger claim to championship status to be that of a guy who has fought by the rules for years at the weight class, stopping 7 or 8 world ranked contenders? Or that of a guy who has never fought at that division, had one fight with a fake middleweight label on it then meekly handed over his belt, refusing to fight the other guy, proclaimed he was "not a middleweight" and moved back down to fight at 154? The answers to this allows us to distinguish those who are legitimate fans of the sport from those who are masquerading as fans and simply have one fighter's interests at heart.

 

You are kicking a brick, I agree with you but don't waste your time

 

This is getting silly. Again, there is no lineal champion because Martinez's last fight at the middleweight limit was his win over Murray. But regardless of technicalities, to any right minded fan OF THE SPORT, Golovkin is clearly the top dog at 1t60 and will be until he retires, moves up or somebody beats him. Hell, Jacobs might beat him and if he does then he becomes the top dog.

 

(Sigh!) alright I'll try and do this in as simple terms as possible. They are official because they have a name, a headquarters, a bank account, rankings, a president, elected officials. Can you provide the same details for the organisation recognising this phantom "lineal" title? I won't wait up.

 

Neither will be lineal champ if they win.

 

Nobody gives a stuff. They will be the clearly established recognised world champion and top dog at 160. Then if the winner beats Saunders, they establish the theoretical "lineage". Not that that has any practical value whatsoever.

 

I don't take orders from bet welching trannies.