as of 2024 this may be true, but it wasn’t the case in the 2010’s. Wembley fights were a new thing. dodgy reffing can happen anywhere, but the term “British stoppage” comes with common occurrences in Britain. It’s not as common for American fighters to come to uk, as it is for uk to go there and there are many reasons. The short British bubble may have burst now anyway. It depend what Turki does as he is invested in the British promotors/fighters but it depends where he wants to take it all. Fury had little interest in fighting in uk when he could fight in US A good example is the difference between Froch and calzaghe. Hatton and witter. Etc etc. one went to America for the big stage, the other stayed at home.
He may have been stupid, but unfortunately we don’t see the details in the contracts to know if it was a bad/good offer. Same the other way, whyte may have turned their offers down for good reason. We don’t know if we’re not privy to the contracts
The British stoppage thing didn't come out of corruption. In my opinion it came out of squeamishness following the McClellan and Watson injuries and referees rather being seen to have stopped it a little too early rather than a little too late. What doesn't matter is if it were a bubble or not. American arrogance saw a number of US based fighters miss out on paydays because they couldn't accept that the UK was a red hot market at that point and their own scene had massively declined. BTW Fury wanted to fight in the US when he couldn't draw flies in the UK. He then came home before chasing those petrodollars like every other major fighter in world boxing at the moment.
It certainly appears he was badly advised by an advisor with ulterior motives for doing so. I can't see what detail in the contract would be so detrimental so as to sour the deal in comparison to what he'd go on to earn against PBC guys.
yes I agree, but these are not ducks. They are decisions based on where they are hedging their bets. Like we all do in life, for example we work for companies or in industries we think will serves us best in the long term. Some jump ship at the first sign of a potential bubble elsewhere, some do well and some get burnt from it. Others may take their time and do it later, others may never do it. they are not ducks, it’s just decisions based on what they feel is best for them based on the information they have got.
There could be many details in a contract that would sour a deal. The headline media statement isn’t always true. There are paid solicitors who go through the contracts and advise you for certain reasons. The headline is just to deceive fans. As we are not privy to said contracts, the advice may have been excellent and in the fighters best interest. Assuming it’s not or someone has ulterior motives is just a feeling you have. Gone are the days when contracts were done behind closed doors and each party respects the confidentiality of negotiations. Now at least one idiot from at least one side has to come out and make headlines with “offers made” etc and immature people lap it up and actually believe it. You do know that most contracts are confidential? so the media headlines and rumours are just for entertainment and just rumours. House purchases/leases are less complex than a boxing contract, yet you listen to the advice given to you from the surveyors, engineers, mortgage advisors and solicitors, Because the headline price/bedrooms isn’t everything. im not sure which specific boxer we are talking about (if we are) but rest assured certain ones could have made more, but are set for life anyway.
Do I think Ortiz was scared of Whyte? No. Do I think he mistakenly trusted Haymon to be looking out for him rather than himself via the overall health of his wider stable? Absolutely. So in short I think he was stupid rather than cowardly.
Yes but I wouldn't listen to a solicitor who was also representing someone else who's interests might be directly in competition with my own.
Well then you’d struggle to find a team in boxing. Boxing is a small sport and you’re probably not the number 1 under the promoter, especially if you come from Cuba. We know for sure whyte was not hearns or warrens number 1. If we go by your theories, Maybe they were ill advising him to benefit aj/fury? If whyte lost to Ortiz (Ortiz would have been favourite) he could no longer claim he’s world class and everyone’s avoiding him to them cash out at Wembley with Warren.
That's why you primarily look at the purses on offer. By Ortiz's own admission he was made career high purses and talked out of accepting them. With hindsight it seems pretty obvious as to why. Unless PBC was a company man looking to take one for the team for Uncle Al then he should have taken the Whyte and Joshua money on the table. The Joshua one would have even seen him fighting in the US IIRC.
I wouldn't be surprised especially as he has failed before, however the point still stands he has had a lot more opportunity for big fights than most it's his own fault he never achieved much as an amateur or as a pro.
I suppose it really depends how good you think he was vs Fury. IMO he's HOF worth because he was part of one of the most entertaining trilogies in HW history. Every one of those fights was a classic. Wilder struggled vs Ortiz in his first fight, but managed 3 KD's. 2018 Ortiz was IMO Ruiz level at least. Wilder brutally KOd him the 2nd time. 2 wins over Ortiz. Although you could argue he was lucky it didn't get stopped in the first fight. To be fair to Wilder he does come back from beatings and go on to win/fight on quite often. Prime Wilder gave Fury two good fights out of 3. 2nd fight was a beat down. First fight was mostly Fury dominating but Wilder still landed hard and almost own in the 12th. I still think Wilder is at least 50/50 with anyone in the division besides Fury in 2018/2020. It's difficult to know though because Fury was much better than anyone else he fought.
Wilder is nowhere near HOF worthy (though oddly I think he might wiggle his way into it), mainly because of how he was considered a terrifying puncher not because of his resume. His resume is pretty much the antithesis of HOF worthy. Gatti is in for instance. And I don't think Gatti was a HOF fighter but I absolutely understand why he's there. He had a cult following, and that following was organic. It wasn't born from the age of social media where you can post on IG and be seen. Wilder doesn't have that organic following. Also Gatti was regarded by his peers as a throwback, a warrior win or lose. Wilder's peers don't hold him in high regard as they speak about him. The convo begins and ends with "he's a big puncher". That's it. There's no legend behind Wilder's name or his resume. He's laughed at about not even being a good boxer. He's as far from being HOF worthy despite being a 10 "defense" champion as one can get. It's silly to even be discussing this.
The hall was founded in 1990. Meaning the borderline candidates have not been inducted yet as the Hall has been working their way down from the top. Whatever the minimum bar for the Hall is has not been established yet because the hall hasn't reached that point of its existence yet. Wilder will be in hes the best American HW of the 21st century has the KO record. Shavers is not in but I believe eventually Shavers will be inducted. Maybe a Bruno too. The championship reign is not needed for him to get in. The big disconnect I see with Wilder is looking at him like a 10 time defending champion instead of as just a elite HW who might have broken through and won the belt and held it for a little bit. If you look at Wilder through the latter lens his resume looks a better than through the former. But people are looking at it through the former.
I get what you're saying and I've considered all of that as well. But then if we go by that, Rahman should already be in. Rahman going by pretty much every metric (achievement, name recognition, peak, relevance) was superior to Wilder. Rahman had pretty much been a known guy since he fought Trevor Berbick on TV, and was a name and was in the conversation of who's a top HW up through the end of his (career prime) when Wlad melted him. That's about 15+ years. Going by "elite" ain't always enough. Rock broke through way more than Wilder, and his name was mentioned way more even during the network wars by guys who were on the opposite network. Wilder never had those type of name drops.