A minor boxing mystery to solve-need input

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by burt bienstock, Mar 29, 2010.


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  1. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    GPATER, no it had to be after Nov.8,1950 in Chicago, because we now see the bout on video...I feel in my bones ,that it was a second fight,between Robinson/Dykes, that somehow eludes the record books...All I am sure of that I saw BOBBY DYKES, not Brown..Might have been 2 or 3 years later, but see them, I did...
     
    burt bienstock, Apr 3, 2010
    burt bienstock, Apr 3, 2010
    #46
  2. GPater11093

    GPater11093 Barry Full Member

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    Burt it really is an odd one. Because if it was pre 1950 the fighters probably would have mentioned it before their 'rematch'. But then its a very narrow time frame for it to have been in the Coney Island. Hmmm. Ill search abit more

    Just briefly do you remember how the bout went, is it similar to the filmed one?
     
    GPater11093, Apr 3, 2010
    GPater11093, Apr 3, 2010
    #47
  3. GPater11093

    GPater11093 Barry Full Member

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    Did some searching on Coney Island and Ray Robinson but still zilch, nothing.

    Really annoying this.
     
    GPater11093, Apr 3, 2010
    GPater11093, Apr 3, 2010
    #48
  4. Jorodz

    Jorodz watching Gatti Ward 1... Full Member

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    Hey all-not sure if this is helpful at all but i just checked my boxing register book.

    SRR vs. Billy Brown September 4, 1950 in New York (SRR W 10)

    SRR vs. Bobby Dykes November 8, 1950 Chicago (SRR W 10)

    Sorry if this is a repeat!
     
    Jorodz, Apr 3, 2010
    Jorodz, Apr 3, 2010
    #49
  5. SLAKKA

    SLAKKA Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Hey Bert,
    I checked the dear old Brooklyn Eagle and it got a write up. Definitely vs Brown "a tough italian kid from connecticut"

    Bout was a charity event for bn birth.

    Lemme know if you need more from this.
     
    SLAKKA, Apr 5, 2010
    SLAKKA, Apr 5, 2010
    #50
  6. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    SLAKKA, Thanks for your research in my 'twilight zone"...I am sure the fight I saw was Ray Robinson vs Bobby Dykes , contrary to what the record books show...After all boxrec had until recently that Bobby Dykes was a southpaw...In my minds eye I knew that the boxer I saw , Bobby Dykes, was an orthodox fighter.I was right then, and I still can picture the fightI saw at the old outdoors Coney Island Veledrome, that day...I will when I get back home research this puzzle in my old Ring Mags,from 1950 to 1953..I viscerally believe now as I did then, that Robinson/Dykes fought once before, the bout I saw at the CIV...Slaaka,for many years , while skimming through Robinson's great record, I wondered why his fight with Dykes in New York CIV, was omitted, and until I joined ESB, I kept this quandry to myself...So Slaaka, thanks again, and when I get back home to my Ring Mags 1950=1953,in a month. my mystery remains unsolved...B.B.
     
    burt bienstock, Apr 5, 2010
    burt bienstock, Apr 5, 2010
    #51
  7. djanders

    djanders Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Burt:

    I finally got to speak with my friend, Roy. He's 82, and was/is a great fan of Sugar Ray Robinson, and saw many of his fights...and he lived in New York City around that time. I mentioned your mystery to him, to get his take on it.

    He remembers a Sugar Ray Robinson fight, in New York, in the late summer of 1952, but he didn't attend it and doesn't remember who his opponent was. He does believe that Robinson won the fight in question. In fact, contrary to the record books, he believes Robinson did not retire until closer to the end of 1952 because he probably didn't want the Maxim fight to be his last. He said he was very busy at that time and was upset that he couldn't attend that fight because he had a chance to get tickets to it and wanted to go because there was talk at the time that Robinson might be retiring soon.

    I see Robinson's record does not show any fights in '52 after Maxim.

    I'm sorry I couldn't get more from him, but at least this indicates a chance that the fight you saw may have happened in 1952, after the Maxim fight. Does that seem like a possible time frame to you? Do you remember if the Robinson - Dykes fight you saw occurred after the Maxim fight?
     
    djanders, Apr 5, 2010
    djanders, Apr 5, 2010
    #52
  8. djanders

    djanders Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Incidently, I see that Robinson had given up his middleweight belt by then, so a 10 round, non-title affair with Dykes was very possible in the late summer of 1952.

    Also, I just looked at Dykes' record. He was evidently in New York in the late August/early September time frame in 1952. Interesting!
     
    djanders, Apr 5, 2010
    djanders, Apr 5, 2010
    #53
  9. Jack Dempsey

    Jack Dempsey Legend Full Member

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    Its amazing that someone as famous SRR can have 'missing' bouts on his record, you usually associate this type of thing with boxers either less famous or who fought around the turn of the century.

    Be great if ESB can unearth anything on the the Dykes fight
     
    Jack Dempsey, Apr 5, 2010
    Jack Dempsey, Apr 5, 2010
    #54
  10. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    djanders, thanks for your interest in my frusterating problem...I am in my heart of hearts positive that the Robinson/Dykes fight was in the summer, as I remember, as I posted before, waiting for the late Robinson to appear in his pink Cadillac, and depart from his Caddy to the dressing room..All this I saw from the last row of the old Veledrome, looking down to the outside of the arena...I remember seeing the bout, no knockdowns, between tall right handed Dykes and Robby...My gut feeling that the fight I saw was after their bout in Chicago,1950, now seen on youtube..It had to be their second fight, probably 1952..I might be long in the tooth, but when it comes to boxing, I know what happoened those long years ago..DJANDERS thanks for helping me solve this ommission.. I think the old Ring Mags 1950-53 might yet solve this Sherlock Holmes dilemna..B.B.
     
    burt bienstock, Apr 5, 2010
    burt bienstock, Apr 5, 2010
    #55
  11. darling dame

    darling dame Active Member Full Member

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    burt looked up in 1962&1967 RING record books &encyclopedia and both show 1951 Robby w10 sep 4 billy brown ,oct 10 w10 bobby dykes Rings pretty hard to beat on facts.
     
    darling dame, Apr 5, 2010
    darling dame, Apr 5, 2010
    #56
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  12. My dinner with Conteh

    My dinner with Conteh Tending Bepi Ros' grave again Full Member

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    I don't think Ring will be the answer, but I'll look at some I have of around 1952 in the morning. I think Ring would have surely picked this up for their record book (which doesn't feature the fight in my copy- 1983). Your best bet is definitely (British) Boxing News- it has weekly news of fighters.
     
    My dinner with Conteh, Apr 5, 2010
    My dinner with Conteh, Apr 5, 2010
    #57
  13. Jack Dempsey

    Jack Dempsey Legend Full Member

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    I've asked someone who works at Boxing News to look into this for you Burt
     
    Jack Dempsey, Apr 11, 2010
    Jack Dempsey, Apr 11, 2010
    #58
  14. burt bienstock

    burt bienstock Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Thanks for your interest in this boxing time warp...When I get back home in a couple weeks I will then check my old Ring Mags of 1950-1952 or after...Until then kudows for your help JD...B.B.
    P.S. I am sure that I saw the second Robinson/Dykes fight at Coney Island,NY...Positive...
     
    burt bienstock, Apr 11, 2010
    burt bienstock, Apr 11, 2010
    #59
  15. bman100

    bman100 Well-Known Member Full Member

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    just found this thread, sorry for bringing this old thread back, but im wondering what the result was, burt did the ring mags have anything of this bout between dykes and robbie?
     
    bman100, Aug 5, 2010
    bman100, Aug 5, 2010
    #60
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