A peak joe louis vs a peak lennox lewis

1. That is something I'd agree with, the 80s talent pool/amount of participants was pretty deep. However the sport becoming more global with more Ex-Soviets/Cuban Defectors/Africans has surely increased the talent pool balancing it out somewhat

2. This is a none issue if they fight at a higher pace as many do. Didn't Tua-Ibeaubuchi throw more punches in 12rounds than Ali-Frazier threw in 15? I'm not saying those 2 are better conditioned or modern boxers are necessarily better conditioned but you get my drift, running 8 miles in 36mins if harder than running 7miles in 45miniutes.

I haven't seem many old timers fighting at the same pace and standard as say Pacquaio (baring in mind punch output, boxing on the tip toes showing movement, throwing straight longer punches which are more energy sapping than throwing shorter hooks)

3. Yes but they generally spar far more in preperation. Harry Greb supposedly fought instead of sparring - I'm getting this from 'why pay for sparring partners'. you can learn. You're also ignoring that the injuries a man can pick up from hard fighting to his detriment - brain damage, bad hands...

4. Top fighters generally do not spar less, I don't see any evidence for this, the occasional boxer like Calzaghe rarely spars, but then again he still manages to be a head to head monster

5. In some ways RObinson has been surpassed, in terms of head to head ability its subjective but in terms of speed and defense there have been men to surpass him

6. Good point, but many fighters today have massive hearts. Also if fighters today do hit harder from advances in strength,

 

Louis by KO

 

I'll let someone else pick up the ball on this one, son. Seen it here too many times.

 

No Lennox's feet aren't as quick, but he wouldn't need to play metador being the bigger man, he'd need to keep the centre of the ring with his jab, and look to counter Louis as he comes in.

I also feel Louis was the most open to fast right hand leads and counters, as we saw against Schmelling/Walcott/Marciano. This if ofcourse Lennoxs money punch

 

Fair point re the matador in the centre of the ring, but as I say, I believe that Louis's footwork is quick enough to work around this.

Interesting that you quote the Schmeling/Walcott and Marciano fights, as I said in a previous post, Louis trained in the bedroom & on the golf course for Schmeling 1, and was past his peak for both JJW and Marciano.

I think a case can be made for both fighters in this one, but I believe that Louis would win.

 

Head to Head, Lewis has the technical ability in combination with strength and punching power to get the job done against Louis, but even a winning effort by Lewis would result in him getting hit a pretty good amount by Joe, and who knows if Lennox could withstand many flush brown bombs

 

boxing sure as hell hasnt evolved. Does anyone seriously believe ali wouldnt be heavyweight champ today because he was at his peak 40 years ago? Of course not

and Louis would give the Klitchkos beatings both brothers would never forget.

 

Nonsense; they have creatine and personal trainers now. :bart

 

how r u? Haven't seen you in a loong time

 

1. I agree its gone down in the US/UK, but world wide participation is up

2. Well Margarito never fought for a lineal crown in any division in the modern era, but I don't see any basis for your claim 'he wouldn't have been good enough to fight for the title in the 40s'. Would Cotto not be good enough to fight for the title in the 40s either? 'Records will always be broken' implies sport always reaches new levels.

3. A fast paced 12round fight throwing 100punches a round with lots of movement is harder than fighting a 15round fight with 50punches a round with less movement.

4. Well Khan would be another who combines the massive workrate with speed/movement. and how about the Klit brothers for combining phenomenal workrate with size, strength and speed? 240lb men who could combine those qualities didn't exist pre Lewis/Bowe and the Klits are fitter men than Lewis was, albeit not as good in other areas

5. Well yes something that isn't good for you, may make you worse. Most fighters also don't want to take their pain treshold to the absolute limit that many times and become more defensively minded as their career progresses

6. Most of the top boxers seem to spar plenty, Mayweather for example spars multiple 15miniute rounds

7. I'm assuming your talking about 100rounds per camp and not per day? I wouldn't think it rare. But just like yourself I don't have the ins and outs of everyones training schedule

8. In your opinion, we can't measure if hes been surpassed, its sacreligous to say he's been surpassed but without a measuring tool we don't know if Leonard, Hearns, Duran, Whitaker, Jones Jr, Mayweather, surpassed him or not

Some things you don't account for:

1. More full time boxers today (many boxers in the past were semi-pro) - dedicating your life to boxing will generally make you better, Walcott/Braddock improved after dedicating themselves to the sport

2. Knowledge is boxing, the boxers from the competitive 20s/30s/40s/50s passed on their knowledge to the 60s-90s boxers, perhaps even learning from their mistakes. Thats sports evolution in practice and some of the better trainers are still around today although compared to the 80s there is a drop off in old school trainers

3. More access to boxing film libaries for boxers/trainers to learn from

 

Fair enough I still go with Lennox and will agree to disagree, nice to have a friendly debate :good

 

Boxing has evolved, Wlad is so much better than Ali ever was.

 

Absolutely!:good