A point about Deontay Wilder and the ongoing nonsense regarding how many contenders he's faced

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Dubblechin, Dec 3, 2019.



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  1. Work the body

    Work the body Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Man I didn’t realise Wilder has had 10 defences and not one unification fight. Don’t get me wrong I like Wilder, but that is hard to defend.
     
    Work the body, Dec 4, 2019
    Work the body, Dec 4, 2019
    #76
    kostya by ko likes this.
  2. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    I understand what you're getting at, but I still respectfully maintain that the viewpoint your expressing unfairly focuses on the hole rather than the doughnut.

    But building on what you said, if Wilder can establish a valid claim to the lineage and/or unify before this reign ends, the totality of the reign will be viewed much more favorably in any historical content.
     
    Rumsfeld, Dec 4, 2019
    Rumsfeld, Dec 4, 2019
    #77
  3. OvidsExile

    OvidsExile At a minimum, a huckleberry over your persimmon. Full Member

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    Not if you're Wilder. Of course, the WBC would just give him a voluntary defense against an easier argument.
     
    OvidsExile, Dec 4, 2019
    OvidsExile, Dec 4, 2019
    #78
  4. kostya by ko

    kostya by ko Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Both points have validity IMO.

    Wilder to me is an interesting fighter with plenty of flaws but some game changing strengths. Every fight he's in is probably going be exciting one way or another. We all know this ...

    So, if fight fans give him the benefit of the doubt ... up until right now ... 2020 on-wards has to be the time for him to play his cards. Joshua/Fury too because there are too many solid HWs coming up at the moment ready to take their place. So it's either fight a unification or fight these quite formidable up comers.

    Makes for an interesting couple of years, because it looks like Wilder and the rest of the top tier cohort have run out of Molina's, Breazeale's, Stiverne's, Wallin's, Schwarz's and Arrealoa's ... and they've got Usyk, Whyte, Hrgovic knocking on their door. About time ... because I think people have had their quota of lame HW defenses (WBC/Lineal) by now.
     
    kostya by ko, Dec 4, 2019
    kostya by ko, Dec 4, 2019
    #79
    Carl Weathers and Rumsfeld like this.
  5. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    Agreed. In an ideal-world, the winners of Ruiz-AJ 2 and Wilder-Fury 2 both meet sooner than later, and ideally immediately.

    The time for one of them to emerge proven beyond reproach is now. They just need to collectively seize the moment.
     
    Rumsfeld, Dec 4, 2019
    Rumsfeld, Dec 4, 2019
    #80
    "TKO" and kostya by ko like this.
  6. OvidsExile

    OvidsExile At a minimum, a huckleberry over your persimmon. Full Member

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    They have as much legitimacy as "contenders" as Wilder does as a "champion." Ruiz is the champion and Wilder is the #3 contender. End of story.
     
    OvidsExile, Dec 4, 2019
    OvidsExile, Dec 4, 2019
    #81
  7. PistonHondai

    PistonHondai Member Full Member

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    If AJ loses to Andy Ruiz again, how much would Wilder fight AJ for?
     
    PistonHondai, Dec 4, 2019
    PistonHondai, Dec 4, 2019
    #82
  8. George Crowcroft

    George Crowcroft Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    @CST80 Can we have a grammar fix of the title, please?
     
    George Crowcroft, Dec 5, 2019
    George Crowcroft, Dec 5, 2019
    #83
  9. Rusty100

    Rusty100 New Member Full Member

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    Not sure that reply was meant for me as it didn’t makes sense or address the point I made.
    We get it you’re a huge DW fan and that’s cool
     
    Rusty100, Dec 5, 2019
    Rusty100, Dec 5, 2019
    #84
  10. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    He still has not beat anyone good in their prime. That's the problem. Talking about how many alphabet people he beats matters not. Ring Magazine or Box Rec give better rankings.

    Has Wilder beaten anyone currently ranked in the WBC? Only old man Ortiz. What does this tell you. He hold a win over just on of their top 15. How weak.

    [url]https://box.live/world-rankings/wbc/#Heavyweight[/url]
     
    Mendoza, Dec 5, 2019
    Mendoza, Dec 5, 2019
    #85
    Veys9 likes this.
  11. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    WBC, WBC, WBC. BECAUSE THE WBC RANKS THEM.... I'm getting dizzy from all of this alphabet soup.

    I took a look at the WBC rankings, and found something noteworthy. Wilder has just one win over their top 15! That's it and the guy is done at age 40. Please explain why you're propping up the WBC when their champion has so few wins over the active fighters?

    [url]https://box.live/boxers/deontay-wilder/[/url]
     
    Mendoza, Dec 5, 2019
    Mendoza, Dec 5, 2019
    #86
    Loudon and George Crowcroft like this.
  12. Veys9

    Veys9 Let's go Champ! Full Member

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    Oh I completely agree with you, Wilder's record is very weak for 40+ fights and being WBC champion with 10 defences. But somehow it worked out for him and with his fights against Fury and Ortiz, I can at least accept him as a beltholder, even if others deserved it more in my eyes, but one has to beat him first, which nobody did (except for Fury according to my judgement). Many better boxers will fail against his right hand in future too.

    I concluded for myself that Wilder is the greatest puncher when it comes to power and one of the worst boxers, but what counts at the end of the day is getting a W or L within the rules in the ring and he got the Ws so far. I do wish that boxers hold belts, but if they can't beat Wilder there's not much to do about it. Gotta accept it, as much as I dislike that.
     
    Veys9, Dec 6, 2019
    Veys9, Dec 6, 2019
    #87
  13. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Wrong.

    Wilder is 2-0-1 against the current WBC top THREE. And he's fighting Fury (currently rated #2) again next.

    Are you seriously complaining that he's fighting his top contenders?

    * Look at the WBA, IBF and WBO ratings. How many current contenders has their champ Andy Ruiz beaten? One?
    * How many wins does Joshua (their former champ) have against the current WBA, IBF and WBO contenders? TWO in the IBF? (Wilder fought as many current IBF contenders, and he wasn't even IBF champ.)
    * How many wins does Parker (the last champ who wasn't Wilder, Ruiz or Joshua) have against current contenders in any sanctioning body? Zero? (Or one, if you count Ruiz, who isn't a contender.)

    I'm not propping up anyone. Everyone Wilder has fought over the last five years has been a WBC ranked contender. Get over it.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2019
    Dubblechin, Dec 6, 2019
    Dubblechin, Dec 6, 2019
    #88
  14. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    He has beaten one man in the wbc top 15. Who are the other two?
     
    Mendoza, Dec 6, 2019
    Mendoza, Dec 6, 2019
    #89
    George Crowcroft likes this.
  15. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    No, he's beaten EIGHT men in the WBC top 15 since January 2015. They just aren't all still ranked on Friday, December 6, 2019.

    What about this is confusing you? Ratings don't remain static for FIVE YEARS.

    Is this really all you've got?

    All of Wilder's WBC challengers over the past five years AREN'T ALL STILL RATED and he's successfully defended against the current #2 and #3 conteders and he's fighting the #2 contender again next?

    And when he beats Fury in the return ... it'll be NINE WBC contenders.

    SCANDALOUS.

    Give it up.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2019
    Dubblechin, Dec 6, 2019
    Dubblechin, Dec 6, 2019
    #90
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